Why Charlotte Councilman Graham flipped his vote for I-77 toll project | Hour 3

What's going on? Thank you so much for listening to this podcast. It is heard live every day from noon to 3 on WBT Radio in Charlotte. And if you want exclusive content like invitations to events, the weekly live stream, my daily show prep with all the links, become a patron, go to thepeatcalendarshow.com. Make sure you hit the subscribe button, get every episode for free, right to your smartphone or tablet. And again, thank you so much for your support. So Charlotte restored its support for the I-77 South Toll Lane project on Monday last night, caving to a pressure campaign from state lawmakers despite lingering concerns. That's the Charlotte Observer's write-up. And that's fair. The state did pressure the city of Charlotte. And you cannot like that. That's fine, too. I understand this is a political issue. You had some politicians trying to force the city of Charlotte to adopt the plan and keep moving forward with the NCDOT plan because I-77 needs more lanes. Whether those are toll lanes or not is one question. And then the other question is what does that design look like, right? Well, the state says we are not going to spend $ 4 billion on the widening because we have other projects we have to fund. So you're not going to get $ 4 billion. Now you have a private company. They're willing to take out loans and they're willing to build it. And so they're going to want to charge tolls. So we're going to go with that option. And people don't like that option. Understand, we've been debating this now for, what, half a year. And I'm sympathetic to all of the arguments. But if your opposition to the argument or to the proposal is to do nothing, right, you have no. Other alternative, then. Like I'm, I'm not really going to waste time debating it with you because I'm not saying you, you, I'm just saying that the Kings, you, the Royal you, because I, because otherwise like that's a lack of recognition of the problem that needs to be addressed. And there were a lot of people that spoke last night at the public hearing that they weren't offering any other solutions. So after the four city council members tried to kill this thing, and of course, uh, they were unsuccessful. Um, that motion was voted on and then, and it failed. And, um, you had Renee Johnson, you had Victoria Watlington, uh, you had, uh, JD, uh, and you had LaJuana Slack Mayfield. Those were the four council members who wanted to keep blocking the I-77 project. They want to keep blocking it. And, uh, I believe here is the, uh, Here was the final vote there. On the substitute motion to deny action items A, B, and C, as previously read, all in favor of the substitute motion to deny, please. Raise your hands. Four. All opposed, please raise your hand. I can't hear you. Yeah, we couldn't hear. Seven. Okay, the substitute motion fails. We'll now resume discussion on the original motion, which was seconded. I'll entertain discussion on the original motion, Councilmember Owens. And I believe, I think it's likely that everyone wants to be heard. I'll start with Councilmember Owens and work our way around. As the passion in this room and at the dais attests. Quiet, please. Thank you. This should represent everything that matters to you. Quiet, please. Quiet, please. Quiet. No more goals! No more goals! No more goals! No more goals! No more goals! No! No more tolls! No more tolls! No more tolls! No more tolls! No more tolls! No more tolls! It's like the last clap there. Okay, so that was the tantrum. From a lot of the Marxists and they were plentiful in the crowd last night. These were the the Party for Socialism and Liberation, the DSA. They were in the audience last night. Some of them spoke last night. And they continue to interrupt the city council members as they try to explain why they were supporting this, even though they didn't like it. They didn't like the process. They didn't like what Raleigh did. They didn't like what NCDOT did. They don't like a lot of the stuff either. And let me go over to, this is Ed Driggs, the only Republican on Charlotte City Council. He said the people who opposed the project actually held NCDOT's feet to the fire and they got major concessions because of it. This establishes a new paradigm. NCDOT will have learned a lesson from this. However, if we reach this point, having obtained those concessions, and didn't proceed, that would be gone. What would be their takeaway from that? Don't bother. So I think we need to regard this as a milestone in terms of how the community engages with authorities like NCDOT. We need to look upon it as a success for the people who voiced concerns about it and about the fact that it wouldn't really benefit $ 300. Million in cash at closing. Okay? There's no uncertainty about that. At that point, if they don't write that check, they're in breach. And so we're not speculating about their compliance with the terms later than that. I would just say then, in conclusion, I do hope and believe that as we move forward, the benefits to West Charlotte will be apparent, $ 300 million. We spent less than $ 200 million over years on our corridors of opportunity, of which only about $ 50. Or $ 60 million was actually city money. This is huge. Yeah. So NCDOT is like, here's our plan. We're going to do this. Charlotte initially says yes. Okay. Along with all of the other towns, everybody else on the Curtipo, the Charlotte Regional Transportation Planning Organization, the Curtipo, They all initially say yes. Then it's like, oh my gosh, this project is going to knock out a couple of homes in Macquarie Heights, an historically black neighborhood. So therefore, now we oppose it. Now it's racist. Activists get ginned up. The socialists descend, right? They mobilize. Look, they don't care about tolls. The Marxists do not care about tolls. The issue is never the issue. The issue is always the revolution. They are trying to harness community anger and activism for their own political goals in the Democrat primaries. Okay? That's the playbook they're running. They don't care about toll roads. They see the issue. We can make this about us. We can show our support, our solidarity, right? Because that's what Marxists are always preaching. So you got everybody saying, let's do this project. Then it's like, oh my gosh, there's a negative aspect to the project. Now it's like we all oppose it. So now you have two opposing views. What is the best outcome here? What was the best outcome? Was the best outcome to widen it without going double-decker and then just gobble up all of the properties all along I-77 at a cost of more than $ 4 billion paid for by the state? Tax money? That's a better alternative? Was that what they were pitching? No, they weren't even pitching that. I didn't hear anybody offer any actual solutions. Because here's the deal. There isn't any. The problem was the interstate was built through the city decades ago. And as the city has grown, the roads get jammed. Because we are all traffic. You and me and everybody else that's on the road, we are all contributing to traffic. So as long as people continue to drive through the city, you're going to have this kind of traffic. Every city has congestion. So what do you do to combat that? You try to offer options. And Charlotte has tried to do this, right, with the light rail line and the bus service and all of that and microtransit options, right? They're trying all of these different things in order to alleviate traffic. But until people start living where they work, you're going to have congestion, okay? And so you're getting $ 300 million in concessions from the state, which that doesn't ever happen. okay like this is a brand new idea this template you I've been calling it a bribe which it basically is but it's a concession nonetheless does this become the template now other places are going to use this as a model I am sure Like, is that a win? I think you could take that as a win. Ed Drake certainly thinks it's a win. That's $ 300 million that the city would not have had to spend on these things. All right. For over a year now, you've heard me talking about Create-A-Video, great local company in Mint Hill that has helped more than 2 million families preserve their memories by turning old photos, VHS tapes, film reels, and slides into lasting keepsakes. Now, Creative Video is helping families and groups create brand new memories while they're traveling. 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Check out GroupTravelVideos.com. That's GroupTravelVideos.com. Or call 704-846-7870, extension 206. And when you do that, ask for Katie. But Pete, can I just email? Well, yes, you can. You can email Katie, katie at grouptravelvideos.com. Group Travel Videos, from old memories to new adventures, preserving life's moments for a lifetime. Let me jump over to the phones and talk with James. Hello, James. Welcome to the show. Hey. By the way, thank you for playing that clip from The Chanting Marxist. Yes, absolutely. I always enjoy that. I've always felt that once the chanting starts, all intelligence leaves the room. That's a good rule of thumb. Yes, but the one thing I noticed throughout your entire section here was the primary question was never addressed by anybody. The primary question is, how do we reduce the overcrowding on the interstate? You're not going to. You're not going to eliminate congestion. Well, you're not going to eliminate congestion at all with toll roads because you have living proof that they don't work. No, I've already gone over all of these arguments in past discussions about this. It does take some of the cars out of the general purpose lanes and put them into the toll lanes. Not enough to be worth talking about. Well, would you prefer that the state spend $ 4 billion? Yes. Oh, okay, and so raise taxes to pay for more roads? If you want to fix the road, I would prefer that the state pay the money, because it's amazing they could pay the money to put in a 10-lane highway around Salisbury, but they couldn't put in the money to fix the overcrowding problem on I-77 in the north end of Mecklenburg County. Right. Well, because the cost. There was no cost at the north end because we had an enormous median. The south end. No, no, no. There was no cost on the north end because you got a private company to come in and build it. Well, they got a private company to come in and build it, and it's basically unused. Right. Says who? All you have to do is go out and drive up and down the highway at rush hour. I have. I have. I have, too. I lived up at the north end for 35 years, and we have much, much worse traffic now than we had before the toll roads. Well, the toll roads didn't create the traffic. It was all the development up there that created the traffic. True. Because when I moved up here, nobody lived up here. Correct. So it's the land use and the zoning and the growth and development, that's what's causing the congestion. No. Well, what's causing the congestion is the growth. Yeah. The other thing that's causing the congestion is the toll roads don't fix it. Well, that doesn't... No, no, right. Well, hang on a second. You can't say the toll roads don't... You just said that. What's causing the congestion is the toll roads don't fix it. That doesn't create congestion. The growth creates the congestion, right? Because more people equals more traffic, right? Right. Okay, so more growth. So who's responsible for proving all of the growth? Well, the people responsible for proving all of the growth are the people who control the local area that allow people to build the way they build. Right, so the local city council. You have as much chance of controlling any of the local city councils from Mooresville all the way down to the Charlotte city limits as you do of controlling the city council of Charlotte. Right. So you have the city council complaining about the lack of road infrastructure, interstate development and improvements, right? Meanwhile, they're approving all of these projects. And then if the, if the response is like, well, then they should stop approving all of this, all of the projects. Well, okay. Well then what about property rights? What about somebody who wants to sell to a developer? Don't they have a right to sell to a developer? Um, you'd be amazed at the number of people who live up in this part of the county that don't want to sell to developers. No, that's fine. But that's how that happens. Anecdotal evidence is a kind of evidence, but it is not the totality of it, right? People who have large tracts of land have sold their property for development. That's why you got all of the growth that you've got. That's why you got all the multifamily housing projects, all of that stuff, right? So people have the ability, they have the freedom to sell property. to developers, right? They have their property rights. That's what I mean. Like, this is not a single, like people reduce all of this stuff down to their, their visual, um, evidence that, oh, I don't see cars on that, on that tolling. So therefore, well, but I've seen, I've been a car on the tolling. I have too. Okay. So like blue moon, right? So what's the, what's the utilization of that tolling? Probably. You don't know. No, you don't know. I'm going to answer for you because you don't know. Nobody knows. That's what city council was saying was like, we want to see the utilization numbers on the north side. So they don't even know that. The city council has put themselves in a position that they can't fix. Correct. And the thing is that putting in toll roads is not going to fix the problem. Nothing's going to fix the problem. Well, toll roads will not fix it at all, but it will cost somebody a bundle of money. Who? The people who have to drive on the road. The people who pay the toll? Well, the reason that nobody wants to pay the tolls is nobody wants to pay $ 6 at rush hour. Okay, then what happens? You drive in a crowded lane. Right, and the private company that built it and took out $ 3 billion in loans, they go bankrupt. And then we'll get the roads. They did in Texas. Right. And then who takes over the roads? The state. Oh, there you go. So it seems like if everybody agrees, don't give any money to the toll company, they go bankrupt, and then we'll get the roads for free. How about that? Well, I wouldn't have given any money. To the toll companies to begin with. Right. You don't have to. But if their business model is broken, they will go bankrupt. We didn't have a voice in it. Sure you did. No, we didn't. Those of us who lived up here did not have a voice in it. They did not ask our opinions. So that thing went through, that project went through literally years of planning, and all of the local bodies that had an opportunity to weigh in did so. You were represented through those local bodies. And nobody bothered to sit down and ask the people who lived up here what they wanted. I'm serious. I was not in town at the time. I remember when this thing first reared its ugly head, though. This thing was well in the works with the MUMPO, the Metropolitan Union or Mecklenburg Union Metropolitan Planning Organization. I remember watching the news about all of this. There were there were all sorts of public meetings about it. And but again, the process that NCDOT uses, I have agreed, is broken. Two more quick clips here. This was towards the end of Malcolm Graham's remarks. He got interrupted yet again. If you're not willing. I'm here for the work. I am here for the work. Mr. Mayor. Mr. Mayor. Mr. Mayor. Sir. Sir, you are disrupting the meeting. Everyone had an opportunity to. I am here for the work. I'm sorry, sir. In the red shirt. We'll be displaced. Those homes, those histories, the people that live there, they will be. Ma'am, ma'am, we have to continue this meeting. You're disrupting the meeting. I'm asking that you be escorted out. Enforce the rules. You hear that? Malcolm Graham saying enforce the rules. Right. Like you've given them warning after warning, after warning, after warning, after warning. Enforce the rules. You're you are impeding the work of the elected body. This is the heckler's veto. getting people to stop talking because you're shouting them down. It's unacceptable. It's embarrassing for these Marxists if they can be embarrassed, which they cannot be. All right. Then there was. The $ 300 million. Malcolm Graham addresses this. He says this money is earmarked specifically for West Charlotte. It means homeowners are, it means homeowners are protected. Every resident whose home is impacted by this construction is is compensated at or above fair market value. No one is pitching out of their neighborhood without full and fair compensation. It means renters are protected. Every renter displaced by this project is relocated to housing of equal or greater standard at no cost to them. No family left without a roof over their head. No one left behind. It means small businesses are protected. Every small business owner forced to relocate receives full relocation expenses and business interruption compensation. The entrepreneurs who build West Charlotte are not casual of this project. They'll benefit from the project. It means new investment along Batesford Road and Nationsford Road, a civic center or a recreation center, grocery store access to finally address the West Side food desert, land banking opportunities for small businesses So they can own and not rent. Green space investment that occur for people to place and live and work and raise their families. It means a cap and cover, a physical structure, both of the sections of the interstate that literally reconnects neighborhoods divided by this highway 60 years ago. Right. To bridge over the interstate. To connect these neighborhoods once again. There's also pedestrian and bike crossings, safe, uh, uh, yeah, safer crossings, greenways, workforce development, prioritization of local hiring, a legacy advisory board to oversee all community benefit commitments made by the developer. And again, he says all legally binding. Okay. You can not like the project, but what these, what, what Malcolm Graham is describing is the best that the negotiation could yield. And I tend to agree with them. Like, The city attorney did get a really good deal and a lot of money to approve the project, which, as he said, was already going to get flipped because the other towns did not want to pay the penalty. Let me see here. Beth's favorite Russ says, Pete, my whole life has taught me that pitching a fit and screaming like a child gets me what I want. Do you mean to tell me this doesn't work when there's real concerns and consequences at stake? Apparently so. Freewheel says, I'm a commercial driver. I drive I-77 North daily. If the residents of Huntersville, Cornelius, Mooresville, et cetera, want to alleviate congestion, they should learn how to merge. Oh, geez. Oh, no. They should learn how to merge and to stop treating their daily commute like a competition. Stop driving bumper to bumper and realize if you show a modicum of courtesy, a lot of the brake checking and by default, the stop and go accordion effect will lessen. But I've only been a, I've only driven professionally for 27 years across 48 states. So what do I know? Yeah. Yeah. This is why I say we are traffic. Let me see here. Dan says, I pay the tolls. I avoid the congestion. It just is not free. The whiners want it for free. Well, yeah, and I got an email. Somebody pointed out that the North Toll Lane is a cash cow. According to the stats he gave me, it's like $ 129 million last year. $ 129 million in tolls. You know what that tells me? That people are using that toll lane. So this idea, because you don't see enough traffic or whatever, like if the company is making $ 129 million a year, then obviously the market signals are such that these types of projects are profitable for the company to do. So this is why I don't really believe this idea that nobody uses the toll lanes. You don't have nobody using the toll lanes and still collect $ 129 million a year. All right, that'll do it for this episode. Thank you so much for listening. I could not do the show without your support and the support of the businesses that advertise on the podcast. So if you'd like, please support them too and tell them you heard it here. You can also become a patron at my Patreon page or go to thepetecalinershow.com. Again, thank you so much for listening and don't break anything while I'm gone.