Nick Craig Subs for Pete (10-11-2024--Hour2)

[00:00:00] [SPEAKER_01]: Welcome back to The Pete Kaliner Show on News Talk 1110-993-WBT. I'm Nick Craig, host of the Carolina Journal-NewsHour. You can hear me weekday mornings at 5 to 6 a.m. Appreciate you spending part of your Friday afternoon with us.

[00:00:16] [SPEAKER_01]: We just spent the last hour talking about the presidential race and where things stand right now. And if you look at any of these polls that we were talking about, the economy and inflation continues to be a top issue on the minds of American voters in every swing state and across the nation.

[00:00:32] [SPEAKER_01]: I'd like to welcome on our WBT hotline this afternoon, PhD economist Dr. Vance Ginn. Vance, thanks for the time. Some pretty rough numbers from yesterday's inflation report.

[00:00:41] [SPEAKER_04]: Well, that's right, Nick. It's a pleasure to be with you today. And what we saw was that the headline number for inflation, what they will least report, is 2.4%.

[00:00:49] [SPEAKER_04]: So that's been moderating from the 9% that it was back in 2022. But it's still really high.

[00:00:55] [SPEAKER_04]: And if you exclude food and energy, which they look at the core inflation, is up 3.3% year over year.

[00:01:01] [SPEAKER_04]: Both of those are well above the 2% average inflation target that the Federal Reserve would like to see.

[00:01:07] [SPEAKER_04]: And I still see a lot of inflationary pressures. And in short, Nick, inflation is not done.

[00:01:13] [SPEAKER_01]: It's not done, and it's still on people's minds. I mean, Vance, we can look at the numbers and say, yes, it is coming down.

[00:01:19] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm looking at a graph right now. And in fact, it has come down. The real question is, is the impact being felt by the American people?

[00:01:26] [SPEAKER_04]: Well, I think maybe a little bit where they go to the store, maybe they're not spending as much.

[00:01:30] [SPEAKER_04]: But you've got to remember that the prices themselves aren't falling. It's just that the rate of inflation, the increases aren't going up as fast.

[00:01:37] [SPEAKER_04]: So when you look at the compounding effect of what that's done to average weekly earnings since January of 2021 when Biden took office, they're still down 3.4%.

[00:01:48] [SPEAKER_04]: You know, what does that mean? That means you can buy 3.4% less than what you could just a few years ago.

[00:01:54] [SPEAKER_04]: And that's why so many people have been discouraged about the economy.

[00:01:58] [SPEAKER_04]: In fact, nearly 60% of Americans believe we're in a recession, even though some of the other indicators would indicate that we're not.

[00:02:05] [SPEAKER_04]: This is having a huge impact on families' finances.

[00:02:09] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I think it's probably having a huge impact when you look at some of these swing state polls, some of these swing state in their recent polling.

[00:02:16] [SPEAKER_01]: The economy is on everybody's mind.

[00:02:18] [SPEAKER_01]: So when we talk about the CPI from September, was this above or below what was expected before the report came out?

[00:02:26] [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, this is right around what they expected.

[00:02:29] [SPEAKER_04]: When you look at the headline number of 2.4%, but the 3.3% when you exclude food and energy, which is kind of the underlying trend of inflation,

[00:02:37] [SPEAKER_04]: how much is going into the other parts of the economy, like shelter, shelter was at 5%.

[00:02:42] [SPEAKER_04]: So housing continues to be an affordability crisis that's going on, and energy was down about 6%, 6.8%, I believe it was.

[00:02:51] [SPEAKER_04]: And that's one reason why the headline number has been able to come down.

[00:02:55] [SPEAKER_04]: But as soon as that starts to stabilize, we're going to see inflationary pressures start to pick back up.

[00:03:00] [SPEAKER_04]: And so I think that's really what a lot of Americans are feeling today.

[00:03:04] [SPEAKER_01]: Vance, as we talk about this, and again, you talk about shelter, whether we're talking about the grocery store or whatever,

[00:03:10] [SPEAKER_01]: I think folks really want to know, we can talk about the numbers ad nauseum.

[00:03:14] [SPEAKER_01]: What actually has to happen for these prices to start going down and returning some semblance of normalcy back to the country's economy?

[00:03:26] [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, it seems like forever now, Nick, that we've seen these higher prices, and it has been for years,

[00:03:31] [SPEAKER_04]: that we haven't seen this sort of inflation since the 1970s, which was called the great inflation.

[00:03:37] [SPEAKER_04]: And really what we can learn from those lessons of what went well finally in the early 1980s was a combination of things.

[00:03:44] [SPEAKER_04]: The big thing was for the Federal Reserve to stop printing so much money and cut their balance sheet,

[00:03:49] [SPEAKER_04]: which is still $7 trillion today.

[00:03:51] [SPEAKER_04]: But it's also a big part for Congress to stop spending so much and running up massive deficits,

[00:03:56] [SPEAKER_04]: to cut regulations, and also to provide tax reform and make sure that we have a tax system

[00:04:03] [SPEAKER_04]: that's conducive to more economic growth compared to what we have today under the Biden-Harris administration.

[00:04:09] [SPEAKER_04]: And one thing I would note, Nick, is I just did a study on looking at the cost of Medicare

[00:04:12] [SPEAKER_04]: for amnesty of illegal immigrants, and that could be another $2 trillion that Kamala Harris has put out there.

[00:04:18] [SPEAKER_04]: And even Medicare for all could be up to $44 trillion.

[00:04:22] [SPEAKER_04]: So there's still plenty of costs that many people are looking at,

[00:04:26] [SPEAKER_04]: especially Kamala Harris, of adding on the American economy.

[00:04:29] [SPEAKER_01]: Economist Vance Ginn joins us this afternoon on the Pete Callender Show.

[00:04:33] [SPEAKER_01]: Vance, we're also hearing from Kamala Harris that she plans on giving first-time homebuyers

[00:04:38] [SPEAKER_01]: $25,000 in terms of a down payment if they buy a house.

[00:04:44] [SPEAKER_01]: I can't imagine that helps our overall economic system at all.

[00:04:48] [SPEAKER_04]: No, not at all.

[00:04:49] [SPEAKER_04]: In fact, it will cost us even more, right?

[00:04:52] [SPEAKER_04]: It would be on the opposite side of this, being a cost to us.

[00:04:54] [SPEAKER_04]: Not only of the $25,000 that goes to first-time homebuyers, there's nothing free,

[00:04:59] [SPEAKER_04]: so it's going to come from our tax dollars out of our pockets.

[00:05:02] [SPEAKER_04]: At the same time, it's going to increase those new homes for the people that are trying to buy them

[00:05:07] [SPEAKER_04]: by about $25,000, influence us who already have homes, raising our property taxes and everything else.

[00:05:14] [SPEAKER_04]: So this will have a ripple effect, kind of a trickle-down, if you will,

[00:05:17] [SPEAKER_04]: to having a higher cost to all Americans in the process.

[00:05:21] [SPEAKER_01]: Ooh, that nasty trickle-down word.

[00:05:22] [SPEAKER_01]: Some folks don't like saying that.

[00:05:25] [SPEAKER_01]: So, Vance, when we look at this as a whole, it's easy to sit here and poke fun at the Biden-Harris administration

[00:05:32] [SPEAKER_01]: and say all of this is their problem.

[00:05:34] [SPEAKER_01]: But I think if you and I were being straight with each other, this is a bipartisan issue.

[00:05:39] [SPEAKER_01]: Does anybody actually want to get spending under control, or is it just words?

[00:05:45] [SPEAKER_04]: You know, there are a few that are in Congress, maybe the folks like Rand Paul and a few others that are there

[00:05:50] [SPEAKER_04]: who have talked about reining in government spending.

[00:05:53] [SPEAKER_04]: But for the most part, you're exactly right that this has been a bipartisan problem,

[00:05:56] [SPEAKER_04]: no matter if it's a Republican or Democrat president.

[00:05:59] [SPEAKER_04]: But you also have to look at the Senate and the House and the makeup of each one of those over the years.

[00:06:03] [SPEAKER_04]: That's why we're up to $35 trillion in debt with $1 trillion just on net interest payments,

[00:06:08] [SPEAKER_04]: which is more than we spend on our entire national defense of $850 billion.

[00:06:12] [SPEAKER_04]: So this is a bipartisan problem.

[00:06:14] [SPEAKER_04]: It's one that needs to be addressed soon.

[00:06:16] [SPEAKER_04]: Because if we don't, this is going to continue to lead to higher inflation, higher interest rates,

[00:06:21] [SPEAKER_04]: and affordability crisis, which also means more strain on families across the country and in North Carolina.

[00:06:28] [SPEAKER_01]: Vance, you spent some time during the Trump administration in the White House's Office of Management and Budget.

[00:06:34] [SPEAKER_01]: Do you think if Trump is able to get a second term that this is going to be a serious issue that he's going to take

[00:06:39] [SPEAKER_01]: and he can convince Republicans in Congress to do the same?

[00:06:43] [SPEAKER_04]: Well, you know, in my time there, which was the last year of the Trump administration,

[00:06:48] [SPEAKER_04]: we were looking at ways to reform Social Security, Medicare.

[00:06:53] [SPEAKER_04]: You know, really those are the two cost drivers, right?

[00:06:56] [SPEAKER_04]: But they're politically very difficult to deal with.

[00:06:58] [SPEAKER_04]: But it's something that really does need to be addressed.

[00:07:01] [SPEAKER_04]: So I'm hopeful that even though the inclination may not be there to push for reforms and, you know,

[00:07:07] [SPEAKER_04]: restrain spending, that we may be forced in order to do so because of all the other fiscal issues that we have going on across the economy.

[00:07:17] [SPEAKER_04]: And so I'm hopeful that a Trump administration will look at that closely, find cuts in spending where possible,

[00:07:23] [SPEAKER_04]: especially like from the Inflation Reduction Act, which did no such thing.

[00:07:26] [SPEAKER_04]: It increased inflationary pressures.

[00:07:28] [SPEAKER_04]: But there was plenty of money in there to cut and then look at restrain the growth of spending over time.

[00:07:33] [SPEAKER_04]: And just one point here, Nick, is that I've done some analysis that shows if we can just restrain the growth of spending to 1% per year

[00:07:40] [SPEAKER_04]: instead of the 4%, 5%, 6%, 7% per year and increase economic growth by one percentage point from 2.5% to 3.5%,

[00:07:46] [SPEAKER_04]: we could balance the budget in five years.

[00:07:48] [SPEAKER_04]: So it's not like we have to have huge cuts, which I would like in the budget,

[00:07:52] [SPEAKER_04]: but it's just about getting more fiscal responsibility that we can get there quickly.

[00:07:57] [SPEAKER_01]: Vance, you cover this stuff day in and day out all over the Internet.

[00:08:00] [SPEAKER_01]: Where do folks find out more details about you and track what you're following?

[00:08:05] [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, Nick, it's always a pleasure to be with you.

[00:08:06] [SPEAKER_04]: I'm on X.com, or if only known as Twitter, at VanceGinn.

[00:08:10] [SPEAKER_04]: I post from there a lot about these issues.

[00:08:12] [SPEAKER_04]: I'm also at VanceGinn.com.

[00:08:15] [SPEAKER_04]: It has my podcast, Let People Prosper, and a number of other resources for your viewers.

[00:08:20] [SPEAKER_01]: Vance, thank you so much for the time.

[00:08:22] [SPEAKER_01]: Greatly appreciate it.

[00:08:22] [SPEAKER_01]: Look forward to catching up soon.

[00:08:24] [SPEAKER_04]: Sounds good.

[00:08:25] [SPEAKER_04]: Thanks so much, Nick.

[00:08:26] [SPEAKER_01]: That's economist Vance Ginn joining us here on the Pete Calendar Show,

[00:08:30] [SPEAKER_01]: News Talk 1110-993-WBT.

[00:08:34] [SPEAKER_01]: So we were just talking about the economy with economist Dr. Vance Ginn,

[00:08:38] [SPEAKER_01]: and it's on everybody's mind.

[00:08:40] [SPEAKER_01]: It's like 60% of the electorate.

[00:08:42] [SPEAKER_01]: So last night, Kamala Harris did a presidential form.

[00:08:46] [SPEAKER_01]: It wasn't a debate.

[00:08:47] [SPEAKER_01]: She was by herself on Univision.

[00:08:49] [SPEAKER_01]: And as you can imagine, one of the questions,

[00:08:52] [SPEAKER_01]: or at least a couple of the questions, were about the economy.

[00:08:55] [SPEAKER_01]: Wow.

[00:08:56] [SPEAKER_01]: Can you believe it?

[00:08:57] [SPEAKER_01]: When it's on the minds of 60-plus percent of the American populace.

[00:09:01] [SPEAKER_01]: So Kamala Harris was asked a question.

[00:09:03] [SPEAKER_01]: It was translated.

[00:09:05] [SPEAKER_01]: And this is her response to, how are you going to deal with the rising cost of living?

[00:09:12] [SPEAKER_01]: Take a listen.

[00:09:13] [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you for the question.

[00:09:14] [SPEAKER_02]: And your point, listen, I know prices are too high still.

[00:09:19] [SPEAKER_02]: You know prices are too high still.

[00:09:21] [SPEAKER_02]: And we have to deal with it.

[00:09:22] [SPEAKER_02]: Here's how I feel about it.

[00:09:24] [SPEAKER_02]: Again, you've heard my story.

[00:09:26] [SPEAKER_02]: I come from the working class.

[00:09:27] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm never going to forget where I come from.

[00:09:30] [SPEAKER_02]: And part of what we have to do is build what I call an opportunity economy,

[00:09:36] [SPEAKER_02]: where people have the opportunity, like you have described,

[00:09:39] [SPEAKER_02]: for you to be able to work hard,

[00:09:42] [SPEAKER_02]: and your five daughters have an opportunity to then do what they

[00:09:46] [SPEAKER_02]: and what you aspire for them to be able to do.

[00:09:48] [SPEAKER_02]: Without having to worry about just getting by,

[00:09:51] [SPEAKER_02]: I want you to be able to get ahead.

[00:09:53] [SPEAKER_02]: So here's my plan.

[00:09:55] [SPEAKER_02]: It includes what we need to do to bring down the cost of, for example, groceries.

[00:09:59] [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, that's a great point.

[00:10:00] [SPEAKER_01]: Do we have a bell sound effect?

[00:10:01] [SPEAKER_01]: I come from a working class family.

[00:10:03] [SPEAKER_01]: Ding, ding, ding, ding.

[00:10:05] [SPEAKER_01]: So the economy is currently in a terrible position.

[00:10:09] [SPEAKER_01]: And her solution is, and I quote,

[00:10:11] [SPEAKER_01]: we have to deal with it.

[00:10:14] [SPEAKER_01]: And then, quote, I come from a working class family.

[00:10:20] [SPEAKER_01]: Can we just play that for the next hour and a half?

[00:10:22] [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, just over and over again, the bell sound effect.

[00:10:24] [SPEAKER_01]: It's ridiculous.

[00:10:25] [SPEAKER_01]: This is her plan.

[00:10:26] [SPEAKER_01]: It's so funny.

[00:10:28] [SPEAKER_01]: The Democrats are beating up on Trump when the presidential debate happened.

[00:10:33] [SPEAKER_01]: And he said he's coming up with the theories of a plan on how to work on some things,

[00:10:37] [SPEAKER_01]: which, by the way, I appreciate.

[00:10:39] [SPEAKER_01]: Not indicating that you have the answer to every single question.

[00:10:42] [SPEAKER_01]: You can wave a magic wand and solve all the world's problems because you're president.

[00:10:48] [SPEAKER_01]: Trump says, I've got theories of a plan.

[00:10:50] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to get the best people in the room.

[00:10:52] [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to figure something out.

[00:10:54] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm so much more appreciate that than this gaslighting nonsense from people like Kamala Harris.

[00:11:01] [SPEAKER_01]: We have to deal with it.

[00:11:03] [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, really?

[00:11:04] [SPEAKER_01]: We have to deal with it?

[00:11:06] [SPEAKER_01]: What, you don't think 9.5% inflation is practical long term?

[00:11:11] [SPEAKER_01]: You don't think that is rising up the next generation of Americans?

[00:11:15] [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, they're getting absolutely slaughtered right now by the economy.

[00:11:19] [SPEAKER_01]: If you're in your mid to late 20s, early 30s, out of school, trying to figure out your life,

[00:11:25] [SPEAKER_01]: figure out getting married, having children, all that stuff that's part of the American dream,

[00:11:29] [SPEAKER_01]: buying a house, enjoying a couple of luxuries throughout the year,

[00:11:34] [SPEAKER_01]: maybe have a yearly family vacation, that stuff's not happening.

[00:11:38] [SPEAKER_01]: People don't have any money.

[00:11:41] [SPEAKER_01]: And Kamala Harris's phenomenal solution to this is that we have to deal with it.

[00:11:48] [SPEAKER_01]: She worked at McDonald's and she comes from a working class family.

[00:11:52] [SPEAKER_01]: It's no better than Joe Biden's Scranton Joe waking up with oil slicks on the windshield,

[00:12:00] [SPEAKER_01]: taking my lunch pail down to the Amtrak.

[00:12:04] [SPEAKER_01]: Nobody buys this garbage.

[00:12:08] [SPEAKER_01]: So she speaks there for 40 seconds and says nothing.

[00:12:12] [SPEAKER_01]: My plan is to make your grocery prices lower.

[00:12:15] [SPEAKER_01]: Huh, great.

[00:12:17] [SPEAKER_01]: I have the utmost confidence that that's actually going to come to fruition.

[00:12:22] [SPEAKER_01]: Unbelievable.

[00:12:24] [SPEAKER_01]: 704-570-1110 is our phone number.

[00:12:27] [SPEAKER_01]: Mike is hanging on line one.

[00:12:28] [SPEAKER_01]: Mike, welcome to the Pete Callender Show.

[00:12:29] [SPEAKER_01]: Good afternoon.

[00:12:32] [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, how are you doing this afternoon?

[00:12:34] [SPEAKER_05]: I'm doing good.

[00:12:35] [SPEAKER_01]: Hope you are.

[00:12:36] [SPEAKER_05]: Good, good.

[00:12:37] [SPEAKER_05]: Good to hear you on after 5 a.m. in the morning.

[00:12:41] [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, sir.

[00:12:42] [SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.

[00:12:43] [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, exactly.

[00:12:45] [SPEAKER_05]: I wanted to talk a little bit about inflation and what I think is the number one issue.

[00:12:49] [SPEAKER_05]: Before getting there, let me talk a little bit about Scott Jennings.

[00:12:51] [SPEAKER_05]: Because he seemed to make it like he was this chief political reporter for CNN.

[00:12:58] [SPEAKER_05]: And he's not.

[00:12:59] [SPEAKER_05]: He's a paid contributor.

[00:13:01] [SPEAKER_05]: CNN is not his main gig.

[00:13:03] [SPEAKER_05]: He was brought on to CNN to be their conservative commentator.

[00:13:08] [SPEAKER_05]: He served in W's White House.

[00:13:10] [SPEAKER_05]: He's been a Republican strategist.

[00:13:11] [SPEAKER_05]: He started some PR company.

[00:13:14] [SPEAKER_05]: And that's kind of his main gig.

[00:13:16] [SPEAKER_05]: But he does come on CNN a lot.

[00:13:17] [SPEAKER_05]: But it's not like he is speaking for the network because he's a paid contributor.

[00:13:23] [SPEAKER_05]: Sure, he is a paid contributor.

[00:13:25] [SPEAKER_05]: Absolutely.

[00:13:25] [SPEAKER_05]: I just want to be clear with your audience.

[00:13:26] [SPEAKER_05]: And I just want to make sure that they, you know, it wasn't that he was this political reporter.

[00:13:32] [SPEAKER_05]: He's a paid conservative contributor.

[00:13:36] [SPEAKER_05]: The other thing is, and I'm just curious, I mean, the way you're pronouncing Kamala's name is Kamala.

[00:13:45] [SPEAKER_05]: And, of course, that's incorrect.

[00:13:46] [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know whether that was intentional or you didn't know.

[00:13:51] [SPEAKER_05]: Sometimes I get slipped up sometimes.

[00:13:53] [SPEAKER_05]: But you're really consistent in mispronouncing her name.

[00:13:56] [SPEAKER_05]: And I didn't know whether that was intentional or not.

[00:14:02] [SPEAKER_01]: Intentional in the pronunciation.

[00:14:03] [SPEAKER_01]: Do you have the inflation point, Mike, that you wanted to bring up?

[00:14:06] [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I do.

[00:14:07] [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know.

[00:14:07] [SPEAKER_05]: Time is short.

[00:14:08] [SPEAKER_05]: But anyway, I just wanted to mention or ask why.

[00:14:13] [SPEAKER_05]: But, yeah, the inflation point is this.

[00:14:16] [SPEAKER_05]: And that is just to go back to the origins of it and to if you're going to solve a problem, you've got to be realistic about it.

[00:14:24] [SPEAKER_05]: And one of the first things to be realistic about, Nick, is how this thing all started and to understand this is a worldwide problem.

[00:14:32] [SPEAKER_05]: This is not a creation of Joe Biden.

[00:14:35] [SPEAKER_05]: This is something that came out of the pandemic that has been experienced by the entire industrialized world.

[00:14:43] [SPEAKER_05]: And that, frankly, America is handling it as well or better than any other industrialized country.

[00:14:48] [SPEAKER_05]: All right?

[00:14:49] [SPEAKER_01]: Would you argue that 9% inflation in June of 2022 was handling it well?

[00:14:54] [SPEAKER_01]: June of 2022?

[00:14:56] [SPEAKER_05]: Well, compared to the inflation rates in other industrialized countries, you know, we were right on par with it.

[00:15:03] [SPEAKER_05]: We were not by ourselves.

[00:15:04] [SPEAKER_05]: And so the way we responded to it was through a mixture of different policies that has over time worked.

[00:15:10] [SPEAKER_05]: And it's worked as well or better than any other country.

[00:15:13] [SPEAKER_05]: And you can just look at the stats and see that.

[00:15:14] [SPEAKER_05]: But my point is, it's a product of coming out of the pandemic with a real high demand and a very low supply because of loss of manufacturing.

[00:15:26] [SPEAKER_05]: And frankly, Putin coming into Ukraine and cutting off half the wheat supply didn't help things very much.

[00:15:32] [SPEAKER_05]: Mike, I completely agree.

[00:15:34] [SPEAKER_01]: I completely understand the point that you're making.

[00:15:36] [SPEAKER_01]: And I appreciate your call this afternoon, as you mentioned, a little short on time.

[00:15:39] [SPEAKER_01]: I think if you asked the vast majority of the American populace whether they felt that the economy was being handled in a good or sufficient way, the answer would be no.

[00:15:52] [SPEAKER_01]: Which is why when you look and talk to voters, whether it's on MSNBC, CNN, Fox News, whatever network you choose, anytime they're talking to voters, it all harps back to the economy.

[00:16:06] [SPEAKER_01]: I can't necessarily subscribe to the idea that we handled it as best as we could.

[00:16:11] [SPEAKER_01]: The Inflation Reduction Act handled it.

[00:16:13] [SPEAKER_01]: It ballooned spending.

[00:16:16] [SPEAKER_01]: It didn't help reduce inflation at all.

[00:16:18] [SPEAKER_01]: You can't spend more money at the level of the federal government and claim that it's helping inflation.

[00:16:25] [SPEAKER_01]: We're in this mess because the federal government, unlike you and I, who have to live within our means, they're incapable, completely 100% incapable of doing that.

[00:16:38] [SPEAKER_01]: That is one of, yes, there are other factors, but that is one of the big reasons that inflation was at almost 9% in June of 2022.

[00:16:48] [SPEAKER_01]: Of course, it's been hard to escape coverage out of western North Carolina.

[00:16:52] [SPEAKER_01]: Two weeks ago, complete and total devastation unfolded in the western half of our state.

[00:16:57] [SPEAKER_01]: I thought it would be great to get an on-the-ground update.

[00:17:00] [SPEAKER_01]: Welcome to Donna King from the Carolina Journal to the Pete Callender Show this afternoon.

[00:17:05] [SPEAKER_01]: Donna was embedded with the National Guard yesterday.

[00:17:08] [SPEAKER_01]: Donna, tell us a little bit about that and what you saw firsthand.

[00:17:11] [SPEAKER_03]: Wow.

[00:17:12] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, Nick, it was really interesting.

[00:17:13] [SPEAKER_03]: We had an opportunity.

[00:17:15] [SPEAKER_03]: Of course, we've been, just like everybody else, our social media bombarded with updates and rumors and all these other things that we're seeing coming from western North Carolina.

[00:17:24] [SPEAKER_03]: And you just – you can't argue that this has been absolutely devastating.

[00:17:29] [SPEAKER_03]: There are areas of western North Carolina that just simply will not be the same again.

[00:17:34] [SPEAKER_03]: We had the opportunity.

[00:17:35] [SPEAKER_03]: We wanted to, you know, kind of get as much as we could of a look on the ground of what's happening.

[00:17:39] [SPEAKER_03]: We went with the National Guard left out of Salisbury, North Carolina, which is an amazing group of really professional service members.

[00:17:48] [SPEAKER_03]: We traveled to Yancey County and met some folks in the neighborhood there delivering generators and fuel for those generators.

[00:17:58] [SPEAKER_03]: These folks have been, of course, without power for two weeks.

[00:18:02] [SPEAKER_03]: In this particular neighborhood, they had what they call gravity water, spring waters.

[00:18:06] [SPEAKER_03]: They were among the fortunate ones that did not have a total loss of their water system.

[00:18:10] [SPEAKER_03]: But the devastation is just unbelievable.

[00:18:14] [SPEAKER_03]: Roads cut off.

[00:18:16] [SPEAKER_03]: You know, when we're getting into cold weather, even just this week.

[00:18:19] [SPEAKER_03]: So long term, most folks have said that I think the big takeaway of this is how these communities, churches, local fire officials, local sheriffs, you know, all of these different groups, public schools, have really come together to help each other and make sure everybody is fed, everybody is warm, and has the medical care they need.

[00:18:41] [SPEAKER_01]: You talk about delivering generators to those areas.

[00:18:44] [SPEAKER_01]: You joined me this morning on the Carolina Journal-NewsHour.

[00:18:47] [SPEAKER_01]: Some of these folks, Donna, could be without power for close to a year.

[00:18:51] [SPEAKER_03]: That's what they're hearing.

[00:18:52] [SPEAKER_03]: They're being told eight to ten months.

[00:18:55] [SPEAKER_03]: In that area, the power comes from Tennessee.

[00:18:59] [SPEAKER_03]: And one of the gentlemen that I spoke with said he hiked over the ridge to check on some elderly neighbors.

[00:19:05] [SPEAKER_03]: And he said just seeing that little bit, every pole is tangled, the wires look like spaghetti, and they're going to need, you know, 100 miles of, you know, new lines to go in there.

[00:19:16] [SPEAKER_03]: So it really, truly may take, you know, he thinks eight to ten months is conservative.

[00:19:21] [SPEAKER_01]: That's almost unbelievable to imagine.

[00:19:24] [SPEAKER_01]: Donna King from the Carolina Journal joins us this afternoon on the Pete Callender Show.

[00:19:28] [SPEAKER_01]: Donna, this group, this area that you were in, are they, for all intents and purposes, still cut off from the vast majority of civilization minus air support?

[00:19:37] [SPEAKER_01]: What's their current status?

[00:19:39] [SPEAKER_03]: They are.

[00:19:40] [SPEAKER_03]: And from what we're seeing in most of the, and this is true of most of these areas, that's one of the things that makes this so different than places like Florida, where you may have 3 million people living in 20 square miles of flat land.

[00:19:51] [SPEAKER_03]: In this case, you've got communities of 50, maybe even 100 people living in very small areas separated by mountains, but spread out over 25 counties.

[00:20:03] [SPEAKER_03]: So, you know, the recovery process looks very, very different for those areas.

[00:20:08] [SPEAKER_03]: And then most of them are cut off.

[00:20:10] [SPEAKER_03]: You have maybe half of one lane along a mountainside is connected then to the outside world.

[00:20:16] [SPEAKER_03]: So you're seeing a lot of folks with, you know, side-by-sides and four-wheelers using those to transport products.

[00:20:22] [SPEAKER_03]: Overwhelmingly, though, we're seeing these churches, that churches are emerging as the community hub for making sure people are accounted for, making sure they have water, making sure they have food.

[00:20:32] [SPEAKER_03]: You have one family we spoke to.

[00:20:34] [SPEAKER_03]: They are the youngest in their community.

[00:20:36] [SPEAKER_03]: Everybody in their community is older.

[00:20:38] [SPEAKER_03]: So they're delivering 80 meals a night to their community because they've just sort of emerged as the only ones who could physically take this on.

[00:20:46] [SPEAKER_03]: And it is really an interesting way to see how they're tackling this and how they're taking care of their neighbors.

[00:20:53] [SPEAKER_03]: But what's the long term?

[00:20:55] [SPEAKER_03]: You can't do that forever.

[00:20:56] [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, absolutely.

[00:20:57] [SPEAKER_01]: And you talk about the church and the community effort all rallying alongside each other to try and get to, obviously not normal, but some semblance of normalcy with running water, electricity and food, some of the basics.

[00:21:09] [SPEAKER_01]: In this area that you were in yesterday, has there been anything from FEMA, the federal government?

[00:21:15] [SPEAKER_01]: We know there's been a lot of calls for everything is misinformation.

[00:21:18] [SPEAKER_01]: If you say FEMA's not there, what were these folks' experience?

[00:21:22] [SPEAKER_03]: The people that I spoke to, and I spoke to multiple families and men, but it was all in Yancey County, our contact with the National Guard, we landed a Chinook helicopter right in the middle of someone's what looked like an open green space in their yard, basically.

[00:21:37] [SPEAKER_03]: It was their first contact with anybody from the federal government, including FEMA.

[00:21:41] [SPEAKER_03]: And so some of them said that they had gotten, you know, once they were able to get a Starlink connection, because one of the neighbors had a Starlink, they were getting, like, emails or text messages to sign up for FEMA, you know, the immediate individual assistance relief, which would be the, you know, $750 to keep talking about.

[00:22:00] [SPEAKER_03]: Some of them did get a message to sign up, but they haven't actually seen anybody or gotten any kind of assistance in any other way.

[00:22:09] [SPEAKER_03]: One person said he signed up just to see what he would get, and he got two nights in a hotel in Charlotte.

[00:22:15] [SPEAKER_03]: And he said, it's just not going to help me.

[00:22:16] [SPEAKER_03]: I've got farm animals.

[00:22:18] [SPEAKER_03]: My parents live across the street.

[00:22:19] [SPEAKER_03]: There's, you know, my kid, two nights in a hotel room in Charlotte when I can't even get, you know, down this mountain because there's no road.

[00:22:25] [SPEAKER_03]: It's not going to help me.

[00:22:26] [SPEAKER_03]: So there's definitely a disconnect between how you would normally treat a hurricane-ravaged area and what this situation is.

[00:22:34] [SPEAKER_03]: It's very, very different.

[00:22:36] [SPEAKER_01]: It is obviously very different, and as you highlighted earlier, the terrain and the geographical challenges there make this unlike many other natural disasters that we may see.

[00:22:47] [SPEAKER_01]: So, Donna, with this, power potentially out for eight months, you know, essentially one family delivering 80 meals a night.

[00:22:54] [SPEAKER_01]: Was there any discussion about what are the long-term plans with this?

[00:22:57] [SPEAKER_01]: As you noted, this is not sustainable long-term.

[00:23:00] [SPEAKER_03]: It's really not.

[00:23:01] [SPEAKER_03]: One of them said that there are a lot of families there that have propane generators because they have it for, you know, ice storms and what you would normally see in the mountains.

[00:23:09] [SPEAKER_03]: But because these roads are so damaged, these propane trucks can't get to them to refill them.

[00:23:15] [SPEAKER_03]: So if they can get some of the roads situated, they can start getting in alternative forms of power so that they can get through those, you know, eight months and cold weather and all of those things.

[00:23:25] [SPEAKER_03]: So I think the first issue is for most of these areas is to get access.

[00:23:30] [SPEAKER_03]: Once they cannot get access, they can get temporary cell towers up.

[00:23:33] [SPEAKER_03]: They can get propane tanks and more generators out because right now, truly, for most of these areas, just like what we saw yesterday, the only way in and out is by air.

[00:23:41] [SPEAKER_03]: And that is really limiting because you also have, while there are a ton of volunteers, there's some groups that have just been amazing using private helicopters and things like that.

[00:23:51] [SPEAKER_03]: There's still limitations on finding a landing zone, finding a place where you can safely land, make sure that, you know, these air patterns and flight patterns aren't conflicting and creating more of a danger.

[00:24:02] [SPEAKER_03]: Because from what I heard, there have been some real near misses, especially in those first days when everybody was up there trying to help.

[00:24:08] [SPEAKER_03]: So once they get the roads situated in some of these more remote areas, they can start getting efficient and predictable help and alternative forms of power.

[00:24:18] [SPEAKER_01]: Let me quickly ask you about the water situation.

[00:24:20] [SPEAKER_01]: You mentioned in the community that you're in, fortunately, they've got spring water, gravity water, so they're good there.

[00:24:26] [SPEAKER_01]: But in some other communities, especially out in Buncombe County, the entire water system is destroyed.

[00:24:31] [SPEAKER_01]: This is a multi-year process.

[00:24:32] [SPEAKER_01]: You don't just spring up a water treatment plant overnight.

[00:24:36] [SPEAKER_03]: That's exactly right.

[00:24:37] [SPEAKER_03]: Those areas are dealing with a very different situation because you can come up with something for a power alternative.

[00:24:44] [SPEAKER_03]: You cannot come up with something for a water alternative.

[00:24:46] [SPEAKER_03]: And that is really what we're seeing lawmakers, which I am impressed they moved very quickly yesterday.

[00:24:52] [SPEAKER_03]: Parties came together, and they got that relief package passed because I think this truly is – we're sort of building the plane as we fly it because this is such a unique situation.

[00:25:01] [SPEAKER_03]: And some of these areas, like those, will not be the same for very, very long, if at all.

[00:25:07] [SPEAKER_03]: So dealing with a water treatment facility, that is going to be a very long-term challenge.

[00:25:12] [SPEAKER_03]: For now, one of the things I did find is that people said that they are getting a ton of canned goods, bottled water, that kind of thing.

[00:25:20] [SPEAKER_03]: What they also need, though, truly is cleaning supplies, heavy-duty trash bags, winter coats.

[00:25:26] [SPEAKER_03]: It was already cold.

[00:25:28] [SPEAKER_03]: It was 45 degrees at 9 in the morning when we were there.

[00:25:31] [SPEAKER_03]: So we're really looking at a very difficult winter as they move forward.

[00:25:35] [SPEAKER_01]: Donna, I'm sure you'll be documenting this over on your website, carolinajournal.com, where do folks find out more details and keep track of everything?

[00:25:43] [SPEAKER_03]: Absolutely.

[00:25:43] [SPEAKER_03]: Absolutely.

[00:25:43] [SPEAKER_03]: We had some good interviews with folks who've been impacted, but also some members of the National Guard who are talking about this process and what they're learning in going through this and what they're delivering and what their role is.

[00:25:56] [SPEAKER_03]: Because it really is an important piece of the puzzle as we make these plans and see moving forward if something like this were to ever happen again.

[00:26:02] [SPEAKER_03]: You can see it on our YouTube, on carolinajournal.com, and on our YouTube channel, and, of course, all of our social media channels.

[00:26:08] [SPEAKER_01]: Donna, thanks so much for the time this afternoon.

[00:26:10] [SPEAKER_01]: Appreciate it.

[00:26:11] [SPEAKER_01]: Great to talk to you.

[00:26:12] [SPEAKER_01]: So we just had that conversation with Donna King, who's the editor-in-chief over at carolinajournal.com, about her experience being embedded with the National Guard yesterday and visiting a community in Yancey County.

[00:26:26] [SPEAKER_01]: And it's such a shame that this storm has become a political issue.

[00:26:32] [SPEAKER_01]: Now, of course, the Democrats will point and say, well, that's, of course, Trump's fault because, you know, the fact that today's Friday is also Trump's fault.

[00:26:40] [SPEAKER_01]: The fact that it was 40 degrees when you woke up this morning and fall weather's coming.

[00:26:43] [SPEAKER_01]: That's Trump's fault, too.

[00:26:44] [SPEAKER_01]: Everything that could possibly happen in the world is, of course, the fault of former President Donald Trump.

[00:26:51] [SPEAKER_01]: Instead of just saying we're working on this, instead of saying this is an unprecedented situation, this is incredibly complex.

[00:27:01] [SPEAKER_01]: We don't have a playbook for this.

[00:27:03] [SPEAKER_01]: You know, federal government with all of their processes and binders full of three ring binders full of thousands of pages of standard operating procedures.

[00:27:12] [SPEAKER_01]: There is no standard operating procedure for the devastation that we've seen out West.

[00:27:17] [SPEAKER_01]: We know that.

[00:27:18] [SPEAKER_01]: But the conversation hasn't been, how can FEMA do better?

[00:27:22] [SPEAKER_01]: The conversation hasn't been, how do we learn from this and move on?

[00:27:28] [SPEAKER_01]: It's been that everybody and anybody that is critical of the federal government's response to this is a right wing extremist.

[00:27:36] [SPEAKER_01]: And you're producing misinformation.

[00:27:40] [SPEAKER_01]: It's all misinformation.

[00:27:42] [SPEAKER_01]: Anything and everything.

[00:27:43] [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we just heard from the ground that the National Guard delivering generators to this community in Yancey County yesterday is the first experience they had had with the federal government.

[00:27:55] [SPEAKER_01]: The hurricane slash tropical storm hit that area 13 days prior as of yesterday.

[00:28:02] [SPEAKER_01]: 13 days.

[00:28:04] [SPEAKER_01]: Yet, if you claim that the feds are not there, that FEMA is not there, misinformation.

[00:28:13] [SPEAKER_01]: Why is that the case?

[00:28:14] [SPEAKER_01]: Why is it so hard for us to look at a situation and go, hmm, we weren't prepared for this.

[00:28:23] [SPEAKER_01]: We don't have standard operating procedures.

[00:28:26] [SPEAKER_01]: We don't have a game plan for devastation in a geographical area like the mountains of North Carolina.

[00:28:32] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm okay with that.

[00:28:34] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't need all of the answers.

[00:28:36] [SPEAKER_01]: I just need to know that this is something you're working on and this is something that you want to do better on.

[00:28:42] [SPEAKER_01]: But now that conversation is completely gone.

[00:28:46] [SPEAKER_01]: Republicans call out the federal government's response, rightfully so, and Democrats claim that all of those people are hurting people.

[00:28:54] [SPEAKER_01]: You're hurting them.

[00:28:55] [SPEAKER_01]: You're hurting the federal government.

[00:28:59] [SPEAKER_01]: Propaganda.

[00:28:59] [SPEAKER_01]: Misinformation.

[00:29:01] [SPEAKER_01]: People now don't trust FEMA.

[00:29:02] [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah, like people just had this blanket trust of the federal government prior to Hurricane Helene.

[00:29:07] [SPEAKER_01]: Give me a break.

[00:29:10] [SPEAKER_01]: At a General Assembly news conference earlier in the week, Representative Pless, who represents portions of western North Carolina, talked about the response.

[00:29:20] [SPEAKER_01]: And he noted that, yes, there does need to be criticism.

[00:29:24] [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, we do need to look at this.

[00:29:26] [SPEAKER_01]: But he said right now is not the time.

[00:29:28] [SPEAKER_01]: I want to play that for you because I think it's pretty powerful coming from a guy who's representing these individuals and lives in this community.

[00:29:35] [SPEAKER_01]: Take a listen.

[00:29:36] [SPEAKER_00]: But I want to speak to some of the concerns that I have as a co-chair of the emergency management oversight and disaster committees in the House.

[00:29:48] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm concerned, just like everyone else, that we didn't do everything correct.

[00:29:53] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not going to dismiss everything I've heard as being misinformation.

[00:29:57] [SPEAKER_00]: But I am going to say there's a time and there is a place for us to figure out what went wrong.

[00:30:02] [SPEAKER_00]: I've sat in on hearings for Matthew Florence and Tropical Storm Fred.

[00:30:07] [SPEAKER_00]: There's no one in this room that's perfect and there's no agency in this state that's perfect.

[00:30:12] [SPEAKER_00]: But we need to figure out what didn't work.

[00:30:14] [SPEAKER_00]: We need to figure out what didn't happen.

[00:30:16] [SPEAKER_00]: And we need to put North Carolina on a path to where as these storms come and there will be more, we don't repeat the same mistakes.

[00:30:25] [SPEAKER_00]: So I want to speak to the folks in the mountains specifically that have been saying a lot of things about the frustrations.

[00:30:32] [SPEAKER_00]: We hear you.

[00:30:33] [SPEAKER_00]: We really do hear you.

[00:30:35] [SPEAKER_00]: And we are going to find out.

[00:30:37] [SPEAKER_00]: Trust us.

[00:30:38] [SPEAKER_00]: But you're going to have to give us some time because getting people in safe locations and taking care of folks that are hurt is going to be the priority for several months.

[00:30:49] [SPEAKER_01]: Props to Representative Plus.

[00:30:51] [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that is the perfect answer.

[00:30:54] [SPEAKER_01]: Is there issues?

[00:30:55] [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.

[00:30:55] [SPEAKER_01]: And he even said, I'm not going to just dispel all of this as misinformation, which is the easy thing that the media has done and the easy thing that the Democrats have done.