NC Auditor investigating Charlotte City Council corruption (05-21-2025--Hour1)

[00:00:04] What's going on? Thank you so much for listening to this podcast. It is heard live every day from noon to 3 on WBT Radio in Charlotte. And if you want exclusive content like invitations to events, the weekly live stream, my daily show prep with all the links, become a patron, go to thepetecalendershow.com. Make sure you hit the subscribe button, get every episode for free, right to your smartphone or tablet. And again, thank you so much for your support.

[00:00:29] Let's start with our Charlotte City Council corruption chicanery, whatever you'd like to call it. We have a new chapter in this unfolding saga. Now that the North Carolina State Auditor has announced via a letter to the Charlotte City Council and mayor that he will be probing them. Ew. He will be investigating them. Yes.

[00:00:57] He's investigating the city of Charlotte over its reported payoff, or as the Charlotte Observer calls it, a settlement. I think it's a payoff. I think a settlement occurs when you have litigation. And there isn't litigation. There wasn't litigation. There were no lawsuits filed. So it's just a payoff. Or a payout, if you'd like a little bit more palatable of a term. It's a payoff to the Charlotte-Mecklenburg police chiefs.

[00:01:25] Johnny Jennings. Over what? We don't know. But as best I can tell, I'm going with the hurt feelings narrative. Because again, there's no lawsuit filed. And without a lawsuit filed, there's no outline of harms actually suffered or alleged.

[00:01:49] And even the ones that are alleged were not defamatory because they were not public to a third party. And if they were public to a third party, they were only made public by apparently the chief himself. In trying to get an ethics complaint filed with the city attorney against city councilman Tark Bakari. Tark Bakari no longer on city council. Edwin Peacock was named his replacement on Monday.

[00:02:19] Tark Bakari took a job up in the Trump administration. Tark Bakari.

[00:02:51] The hands of the chief. The chief's hands. That crafted the language that then wound up in the ethics complaint. And apparently reports are that she submitted a Freedom of Information Act request. In order to get evidence of. You know, the nature of the defamatory language that councilman Bakari used against police chief Jennings. And in submitting that FOIA request.

[00:03:19] She knew apparently the keywords from the private text message exchanges between the chief and Bakari. So that tells me that the chief gave the text messages or told her to FOIA the city for these text messages and use these keywords to ensure that she got the correct evidence that she could then incorporate into the ethics complaint. Again, with other language that was crafted by the hands of the chief. And.

[00:03:50] Submits that to the city attorney. The city attorney then says no to your ethics complaint. No. There's no there's no merit here for an ethics violation. But then the city attorney, the interim city attorney, Anthony Fox, turns around and advises. So the reports are that the city council needs to approve the payoff to the chief reportedly of about three hundred thousand dollars.

[00:04:19] We don't know if it's three hundred thousand, two hundred thousand, a billion. We don't know because the city attorney refuses to release the settlement. The amount. What for whatever. And he claims it's part of the personnel records of the chief. That is an opinion that is not shared by basically any other lawyer. Then you have the matter of the way the city council.

[00:04:49] Voted on the payoff. Because the. The dismissal of the ethics complaint. Was apparently reportedly not known. To several of the city council members. How many don't know. They won't talk about that. We don't know. Who was aware of the ethics complaint. Dismissal. Before they agreed to the payoff. Some of them.

[00:05:18] Some council members have told. Reporters in town. That they were not aware. Of the ethics complaint. Dismissal. And that that may have changed their vote. Knowing that information. So who knew about the ethics complaint dismissal. Why would the city attorney dismiss the ethics complaint. But then advise the payoff. What was the legal rationale for it. And what are. The harms alleged.

[00:05:47] We don't know. Defamation requires there be a third person. That hears the defamation. Otherwise it's not defamation. If I call you. A bunch of bad names. And it's just us on the phone together. Or me in a text message with you. And I don't say it in public. And you don't say these things in public. Then there is no defamation. Right. There isn't any third party to hear the defamatory language. So why would you settle.

[00:06:17] It doesn't make any sense. None of this makes any sense. Except. What I hypothesize. Based on the. The reports and what limited information we have. My hypothesis. Is simply that during the fight over the vests. The bulletproof vests. That Bakari said. A lot of rank and file officers want to wear. Instead of the. Under the shirt vest.

[00:06:47] They wanted the outer carrier vest. And what I suspect occurred. I don't know this. I want to be very clear. This is wild speculation. What I suspect may have occurred though. Is. There were council members that did not want to take a public stance. By voting no. On a budget item. That's my bet. They didn't want to be seen. As crossing. CMPD officers. That were asking for.

[00:07:15] This other bulletproof vest. Particularly. After four law enforcement officers. One of whom was CMPD. Were murdered. While trying to serve an arrest warrant. In East Charlotte. They were shot and killed. And. The rank and file cops now. Asking for these vests. Tark Bakari tries to put it into the budget. And they didn't want to have to. Vote no.

[00:07:44] And so during what's called the straw voting. Where. You have a budget that comes in. That the proposal comes in from the city manager. And. They do. In. They're not binding votes. That's why they call them straw votes. But it's a budget workshop. And the council members. Will just kind of raise their hands. They'll go line by line. Through various budget items. And they'll say. All right. Who supports this spending. And you'll get a show of hands. And if there's a majority. Then it stays in the budget. If there's not a majority. It doesn't get. Into the budget. Or it gets cut.

[00:08:12] But so that straw vote meeting that they had. Bakari pulls the funding request for the vests. But then promises that he will make this a public campaign. He will raise the money privately. Right. He's going to go out. And he's going to get a GoFundMe set up. He's going to raise a bunch of money. He's going to get donations. City council not wanting to go on the record as voting against. Bulletproof vests for cops.

[00:08:39] In the aftermath of the murder of four law enforcement officers. But they. So they didn't want to have to do that. So what do they do? They ask the chief to say no. Make the chief. The face of the opposition to this. Because nobody would. You know doubt the chief's commitment to his own. Officers. So if you make him the face of the opposition. And he comes up with this excuse of. Well the vests make the cops look too militarized.

[00:09:09] It's purely aesthetic. Not the most solid of arguments. To be sure. But he goes out and makes that case. And because the argument isn't so solid. He is mocked and ridiculed for that. So maybe the defamation. Was actually against the city council. For hanging him out to dry. And not standing up and supporting him. While he became the sole. Face of the opposition to the vests. Because when they. When they came out.

[00:09:38] And the city council did their press conference. Not about the vests. And not about the payoff. But about how one of the council members. Was leaking information. And accusing the city of corruption. That made them very angry. They call their press conference. And what do they do? They praise the chief. They apologize to the chief. For not standing with him publicly. Last year during the vest fight. Why would you do that? Was a public apology.

[00:10:07] Part of your settlement agreement. Or maybe it was actually heartfelt. That they do apologize. We should have stood up for you. We should not have been cowards. And let you take all of the slings and arrows. On this. On this debate. That's kind of. That's what I think might have happened. Again. Speculative. I do not know that. But now the state auditor would like some answers.

[00:10:34] And that is entirely appropriate. I welcome it. I'm glad for it. Thank goodness. State auditor Dave Bullock. Announced an investigation. In a letter to Mayor Vi Lyles. And it was shared with the media. By his office yesterday afternoon. After I got off the air. Not that I'm bitter about it. But no. I'm just kidding. But it did come in after I got off the air. I have the letter. I'll give. It's not long. I'll give you the highlights.

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[00:12:26] In my opinion, if the Charlotte City Council cooperates in any way with the state auditor in this investigation, then they are hiding a lot more than people know and they just want him to be done as quickly as possible. So I hope his office digs deep into the council's activities. I had not even considered that. Yeah.

[00:12:50] Well, they've got some decisions to make, both personally and at an organizational level. Dave says, Yeah. That's just where my mind goes when something is meant to be secret.

[00:13:15] Yeah, look, it could be something as banal as they just didn't want people to know because they didn't want to answer any questions and it would be embarrassing. They made a political calculation in an election year to pay the chief, you know, assuage his hurt feelings. We're sorry we didn't stand with you against that mean, nasty Tarek Bakari, but he's gone now.

[00:13:43] He can't hurt you anymore, you know, and now he's up in the federal government, but he's in a position regarding transportation. And the city of Charlotte, we're very much like to have him be a conduit for funding for light rail lines and, you know, bus rapid transit, electric vehicles, that kind of stuff.

[00:14:06] And so you don't want to anger him now that he may have some influence over millions, hundreds of millions, maybe even billions of dollars in transit funding that the city of Charlotte would very much like to secure. So you want to just keep the payment to chief. You just want to pay him off in quiet. He gets his money. It's a hush money. It's a go away money. You know, that could be it. Don't know.

[00:14:34] So here's the letter from state auditor Dave Bullock to Mayor Lyles. But then the city council is also included on the CC. Constituent requests and recent reporting involving the Charlotte City Council have raised serious concerns regarding the potential disbursement of public dollars outside of the public view.

[00:15:01] It is my understanding that there is a possibility that as much as 100,000 to 300,000 in public dollars may. That's italicized may have been given to Charlotte Mecklenburg police chief Johnny Jennings for illegal settlement that may have been entered into by the city council. This is only what has been gathered by the auditor's office from news reports, social media and conversation.

[00:15:30] The truth of the matter remains unclear. While answers to some of the more pressing questions could be provided through quick release of information from your office, which I strongly encourage, there remains a list of unknowns regarding the potential settlement or payout to the police chief.

[00:15:49] On behalf of the citizens of North Carolina and the nearly 1 million people who call Charlotte home, the North Carolina office of the state auditor will be investigating this matter. The office of the state auditor will be asking how much money was reportedly paid out. Whether a payment exists, but we still don't even know that, right? Did they actually cut the check yet? Where did the money come from?

[00:16:18] And several other pertinent questions. Even if the payment was worth one penny, it should be disclosed to the public in a timely and transparent manner. There is no tax dollar free from public scrutiny. Our office will be in contact to establish lines of communication and engagement.

[00:16:40] City council's in trouble. As they should be. So thank you to North Carolina auditor Dave Bolick and his team, his investigators. Thank you.

[00:17:00] They obviously heard, and this is a, right there, the auditor gets involved in stuff aside from like your routine, regularly scheduled state mandated audits and the like. The auditor is only aware of this kind of, this kind of an issue. If you get people that file on, file a complaint through the website or their, their hotline.

[00:17:28] That's where you go to whistleblow. If you think there is some waste, fraud, abuse, corruption, something that requires an audit, you go through the state auditor's office and you ask for that. You ask for some, some attention to be paid to it. The other way is through media accounts, right? Which of course then inform the public and then the public can file complaints.

[00:17:57] But the auditor's office, they, they become aware of these things through media reports as well. So that's apparently the only sourcing. Well, he also says and conversation. So I'm not sure who his office has spoken with about this issue, but I would imagine they've probably gotten some complaints from not just citizens, but people maybe inside the Republican party. Maybe some city council members went to the auditor's office, right?

[00:18:26] But this is what the auditor is supposed to be doing. All right. So spring is here, a time of renewal and celebrations. You got graduations, weddings, anniversaries, and the special days for mom and dad. Your family's making memories that are going to last a lifetime. But let me ask you, are all of those treasured moments from days gone by, are they hidden away on old VCR tapes, 8mm films, photos, slides? Are they preserved?

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[00:19:42] I'm open to other ideas, how we want to brand this Charlotte City Council payoff corruption scandal that has been brewing. Because you always need to have a brand, you know. So you put it on the bottom of the TV, you know, with like a hashtag on it. So, D. Stewart says that the mayor should resign.

[00:20:07] And Melissa says, when you say issue, Pete, and by that I mean chicanery. Yes. Yeah. Chicanery is, I think that's a, I don't know, that's a sanitized word for what I suspect is some form of corruption. I don't know that, but I suspect it very strongly. Let's go to the phones and talk with Rick. Hello, Rick. Welcome to the program.

[00:20:37] Hello, yes. I'd like to say that I've seen some original reporting on this from Steve Harrison. And what it looks like is he said that there was a vote of five to two with two people against the settlement. As you know, there's the city council's 11 people, so you need a majority of six to pass something, and you need seven for a quorum. The original reporting said one of the two people who voted no left the room, and policies and procedures indicated that one of the two no votes was changed to a yes.

[00:21:07] So when I read the Steve Harrison piece at WFAE, and he's done good work on this story, my interpretation was that if it was that the no vote would have been cast. What happened was there was another member that was in the meeting, but before the vote, they left. And that person who, so you're talking about, so it was a five to there were seven voting.

[00:21:36] There would have been eight initially in that closed session and one left. And when that person left, they did not count a vote because they didn't vote. However, you are correct. The rules say that if you start a meeting, if you're there at the beginning of a meeting, and then you have what's called an unexcused absence, you leave. Any vote that is taken during the rest of that meeting when you leave, your vote is counted as a yes vote. And that's been standard procedure in Charlotte City Council meetings.

[00:22:05] I mean, back when I was covering council, that happened on more than one occasion. Usually when they didn't want to take a controversial vote, they would just leave. Or they would show up just to get the yes vote, you know, on the record so they could whip the sufficient number of votes, and then the member would leave. So that's my understanding. I don't know if what you're telling me is that one of the two no votes left and they had their vote counted as a no before they left. But I don't, I have not seen that reported.

[00:22:35] Okay, I just read the Steve Harrison article. And I was wondering if we can get some good reporting on this. Well, it's tough because it's a closed session, right? And the city attorney has been browbeating all of the council members that they're not allowed to leak anything. They're not allowed to say anything about what happens in closed session or else they're going to be investigated and could face criminal charges. And that's not true. Not for this kind of information. That's just not true.

[00:23:05] Now, it does harm the trust, right, among city council members and staff that you're in a closed session meeting. And if you're talking about stuff outside of closed session, then, you know, they may not be as, you know, interested in having an honest conversation in the closed sessions with you in the future. That's one of the downsides of leaking.

[00:23:26] But my understanding of the way the city council rules operate is that you can't, like, if I, like, if you and I are both in the meeting and we're both no votes and we're like, I'm going to vote no, I'm going to vote no. And then all of a sudden you get called away. We don't count your vote as a no vote because you're gone. But maybe that did happen. I've just not seen that reported. And that wasn't my understanding of the Harrison report.

[00:23:52] But, yeah, but that is the challenge that you face as a reporter, as Harrison is trying to, you know, piece together what actually occurred in the closed session. You've got council members that won't talk. And so you have to try to get some of them to talk anonymously and then corroborate each of the anonymous accounts. I agree with everything you said. And it seems like you and Steve are doing good reporting on this. But like you said, it's hard to do good reporting. Yeah.

[00:24:20] No, it is very difficult. It costs money and resources. And that's why a lot of newsrooms have been cutting their staffs because they cannot afford, you know, you sit outside of a closed session meeting and they come out and they don't say anything. And now you've just wasted, you know, three hours sitting outside the meeting and you don't have a story to turn. And that's not helpful for a newsroom that has to fill the news hole. You've got to have content. So that's difficult.

[00:24:49] So, yeah, it's a challenge. Rick, I appreciate the call, man. Thank you, sir. Yeah, take care. Yeah, I give credit where it's due. If you listen to my show, I am always giving the bylines of the reporters that do stories. I try to give the headlines so you can find it. And I try to give the website so you can find it. But I because I look I you know me.

[00:25:16] I drag enough reporters and media outlets for shoddy coverage or biased coverage. So I try to to give credit where it's due. And like I said, Harrison, Joe Bruno has done good work on this over WSOC TV as well. They've gotten a lot of people to talk about stuff and to confirm details on this story.

[00:25:42] I would not be able to talk about the story as I have been had they not done the actual work. I'm just running my mouth. They were the ones that did the the reporting, you know. So if anything's wrong, it's their fault. Just kidding. No, but it is. I mean, I recognize like because I was a reporter. It's a lot harder to do that than this. That's why I enjoy doing this job. All right. If you're listening to this show, you know, I try to keep up with all sorts of current events. And I know you do, too.

[00:26:10] And you've probably heard me say get your news from multiple sources. Why? Well, because it's how you detect media bias, which is why I've been so impressed with Ground News. It's an app and it's a website and it combines news from around the world in one place. So you can compare coverage and verify information. You can check it out at check dot ground dot news slash Pete. I put the link in the podcast description, too.

[00:26:36] I started using Ground News a few months ago and more recently chose to work with them as an affiliate because it lets me see clearly how stories get covered and by whom. The blind spot feature shows you which stories get ignored by the left and the right. See for yourself. Check dot ground dot news slash Pete. Subscribe through that link and you'll get 15 percent off any subscription. I use the vantage plan to get unlimited access to every feature.

[00:27:03] Your subscription then not only helps my podcast, but it also supports Ground News as they make the media landscape more transparent. Got a message from the hellion on Twitter. I got to Charlotte in late 06. I cannot recall which mayor was around when I started keeping up with council mayor politics.

[00:27:23] Well, if it was 06, that would have been Pat McCrory because McCrory first ran for governor in 12 and lost to Bev Purdue and then won. No, sorry. He ran in 08. He won in 12. And then lost right in 16. And Cooper was governor for two four year cycles. And now Josh Stein. So, yeah.

[00:27:51] So it would have been mayor Pat McCrory in the probably final his final term. The election after McCrory was the election between Anthony Fox, not the interim city attorney, just some other guy named Anthony Fox, who went on to work in the Obama administration versus John Lasseter. Lasseter, the Republican, Fox, the Democrat. And they ran against each other. Lasseter lost. And Fox won. And there's not been another Republican mayor since.

[00:28:23] Anyway, back to the Hellions message. He says, all that I have ever heard, none of them sound like real leaders. I sense most get told what to do. When I hear Lyle speak, I can't believe she is a mayor anywhere. So. Keep in mind, North Carolina has a what's called a council manager form of government. Our mayors are very weak in our systems in this state.

[00:28:51] And because you have a council manager form of government, the idea was that, well, we have the manager. They are professional. And so they will manage. And the council acts as like a board of directors to offer direction, do approvals and that sort of thing. But day to day operations, it's all it's all the manager. So the managers are very powerful in our state. And the bigger the city gets, the more staff you get that works for the manager. And so a lot like in Charlotte.

[00:29:20] And it's been this way for 40 years. It is a staff driven process. Everything staff driven. Because when you are a newbie council member, you come on and. You don't know what the processes are. You don't know who the people are. You don't know where the bodies are buried, all of that stuff.

[00:29:42] So you rely on staff to prepare you, inform you, tell you the ins and outs of all of these different issues that you can't possibly be expert on. Right. So you rely heavily on staff. And sometimes you end up then with a relationship where the council members become very dependent on staff and then protective of staff.

[00:30:09] The city manager is always protective of their staff, too. So. So. Like, that's always the dynamic that you've that you've got going on. And so if it's if you get the sense that most of the council and mayors over the years in Charlotte are getting told what to do, there's a logical explanation for it is that. They are. They probably are. They are.

[00:30:37] And that's why some of the best city council members that I've ever. I think the best I ever saw was Don Lockman, the late Don Lockman, Republican from District 6. He was a retired business owner. And he would ask questions because he knew what this stuff meant. Like, he would look at the budgets and stuff. And he spoke their language. He knew what to look for, what to ask about. And he always had them on the defensive, the staff.

[00:31:08] It wasn't mean about it or anything, but he was always on the defensive or he put them on the defensive because they knew that he knew what they were talking about. Yeah. Yeah. Mayoral power is not strong in North Carolina. Russ says, you have mentioned the council rule where if you leave, your vote gets counted as a yes a few times in the last few weeks. What is the benign, non-corrupt governance explanation for such a thing?

[00:31:34] It's so the business of the council can continue if somebody has to leave and then you don't end up with enough votes for a majority. Right. Or, you know, if it's like a protested petition or something like that in a rezoning, whatever.

[00:31:51] So this way, if you end up with a bunch of council members that don't attend, like you get one or two that are sick or traveling, and then somebody has to leave, they can't attend the full meeting, but they can show up and then leave, then you get the vote count. I think that's the benign rationale for it is so it doesn't completely slow down the work of the council. Let's see.

[00:32:20] This is from Moral Compass. You may be thinking to the attorney's advice in the wrong way. There may be criminal charges for leaking something in the closed meeting if they did something illegal in the meeting. Oh, well, no, that's fair. Maybe, yeah. No, because it would be like, well, if you did the illegal thing, then you wouldn't leak it, you know? Or maybe you would in order to throw off the media. I don't know.

[00:32:49] But, yeah, if they did something that was improper in the closed session, there could be exposure there. But, no, the only criminal charges, I think we went over this like a week ago, the only criminal charges that people would face is if they are like divulging personnel file stuff. And, in fact, Charlotte had an example of this a few years ago, had to do with the Charlotte fire captain, I believe, or a chief, rather. And he just got a reprimand.

[00:33:19] No charges were ever filed. So, yeah, precedent isn't even on the interim city attorney's side on this either. All right, that'll do it for this episode. Thank you so much for listening. I could not do the show without your support and the support of the businesses that advertise on the podcast. So, if you'd like, please support them, too, and tell them you heard it here. You can also become a patron at my Patreon page or go to thepetecalendorshow.com. Again, thank you so much for listening, and don't break anything while I'm gone.