Michael Graham on the defunding of NPR & PBS (07-17-2025--Hour1)

What's going on? Thank you so much for listening to this podcast. It is heard live every day from noon to three on WBT Radio in Charlotte. And if you want exclusive content like invitations to events, the weekly live stream, my daily show prep with all the links, become a patron, go to dpeakclendarshow dot com. Make sure you hit the subscribe button. Get every episode for free right to your smartphone or tablet. And again, thank you so much for your support. I'm proud to announce we are now a member of the NPR Emergency Alert System. I was unaware this thing even existed before yesterday. I'd like to welcome to the program the publisher and managing editor of Inside Sources Inside Sources dot Com, Michael Graham, actually formerly of WBT low say. Don't leave out my number one credentials r right. Well you my radio talk show career right there at WDT, my first firing of many. Well, I was going to bring that up, Michael bud. So proud of it. But anyway, you you were gone just before I got here, so we never crossed paths here. I ended up in the newsroom, so you were well. I had a I had a close my contract. Since you showed up, I was going, you know, oh, well, that's I do have standards. You know. I may have played Preiana in a bordello, but I do have standards. I'm just I'm just giddy. I gotta tell you, I'm just just find the life law. My first book that I wrote, in fact, before I start working at AVT, was called Banned from Public Radio because I was actually banned from the South Carolina Educational Radio Network for making fun of state government on the air. And that's when I learned that it's not public television, it's not public radio, it's government radio, you know, like Pravda. Yeah, and so I the governor didn't like what I said. He had me a band from the network, and I when I did talk right here for a living best gig. Ever, by the way, I was just to try me crazy that that would be literally paying taxes so that someone else could take my money and compete against me. Yeah. I was in a talk studio paying money for another guy's talk studio because he didn't have to pay for it because he got free tax money through me. I'd be like, if you know, you know, Joey mcberger joined and then someone shows up. Hey, look, burns vegan patties across the street. It's a lot healthier. So we're going to take part of your money and give it to them for their advertising. What no other industry would put up with that, But that's what we put up with in the era of public television radio. And I'm not a big Trump fan. I've never voted for him, never would, but I got to say, I am ready to buy a maga hat this guy, all of this stuff. For twenty years, I said, bomb Iran, Bomb Iran. They're wack. Jab islamis bomb Iran. They've got nukes, they're trying to build nukes, bombing Ran. Oh, you can't do that. You bombed me Ron. They might do something bad like what fun to terrorism? Attack Israel, beat women for showing their ankles in public. I mean, what the hell? And who bombs Iran? It's not Obama, it's not Biden, it's not w it's Trump. For years of saying it is indefensible that we spend tax dollars on radio and television in the era of the Internet, Are you freaking kidding me? I can pick up my phone and right now watch nude Canadian curling in French with subtitles on my phone because there's so much media in the world and these nitwith Democrats want to fund you know, the little old ladies, Downton Abbey reruns down the Street. Who finally does the common sense thing? Is that Obama? W No, it's Donald. I'm out of my freaking mind Trump, and I don't know what to do about that. Yeah, so on, now, what of the uh this? I got to tell you. I've listened to NPR. I've heard their pledge drives and stuff as well, and listened to like all of their talk show hosts and news stories that are always filtered through the you know, the the trans or racist kind of lens. But I've I never knew that they were such a vital part of our emergency response system, particularly in the rural areas where I can only believe they have massive audience. Right, Were you aware that they had such a network? PBS the peace stands for pick them up trucks bitch? So yeah, I mean, it's just so stupid. I look, I grew up in rural southbound down in Lexnon County where we were. I was literally one of those households that was that PBS was rousially designed for. We had access to three TV stations, one of them was the PPS station. We had to have an antenna on our roof because cable didn't reach us. You know, we point know if you saw you'mon have this. They had the rotor on the antenna. You could turn the dial, would turn it around the point to another town to try. So I look, it existed for me, but never. Never when the tornado sirens went off in our corner Lakes and County that my parents go, oh, tornado's coming. We better tune in that massive piece theater right I here we got some flood and coming. I wonder what that Ira Flato was saying about. Never nothing. This is idiotic. And one of the things I wrote about in this piece of ours that inside sources were on. The managing editor h pointed out that statistically, this is the world we live in. A higher percentage of Americans own cell phones then live within the reach of all the NPR signals combined, which is why we don't rely on radio for emergencies anymore. We use cell phones technology. Why but what planet of these people? The next thing, I know, we're gonna have to you know, we're gonna have to raise your taxes. We've got to have the butter churners coalition out there. We're going to get our butter if we don't have butter churners. Now, I will say when Hurricane Helen hit western North Carolina, knocked off all of the cell towers and all the comms went down, like literally cell phones were not working. The local commercial radio station where I used to work, they because I too, like you, work in radio, have been fired so I used to work up there. But they actually stayed on the air and provided like the only comms link to the entire region, and they joined their iHeart cluster and they all of their stations to simulcast with all of their local hosts. And you know, that's a that's a really good point, and that's something to be said to And this is another reason why the whole MPR PBS argument just makes you want to barf. There have been about I think it's four hundred AM stations that have gone dark gone dark. They're not been broadcasting anymore since in the last fourteen years since COVID. I'm remember the numbers is sixty f M stations that have gone dark. Gone out of business because the media world's changing, it's transforming. If you really care, if you're really worried that someone's going to be in an area that's underserved. What you just said, AM radio just you know, you have the network set up, have the transmitters, translators that can pick up other signals. I was doing talk radio WRBA in Richmond when Irene came through, and I in the studio was right in the line of the storm. And I stayed in the studio and we broadcast, you know, through the night. And like you said, the AM signal was the one thing that could get through. And that's all that. If that was what we were talking about, we were. But when was the last time you watched one of these fundraisers for public radio and they said, we've got to keep our emergency broadcasting network going, So send us fifty bucks, you'll get a Nina tote bag. You know they don't do that, No, they never promote talk. About is what does suburban, college educated, middle aged white ladies want, because that's what it is. NPR is basically streaming for liberal white suburbanites, except they've all hacked and they have our password. So we have to pay for their who left wing Hulu account because they've got our password, and I blame Republicans. Republicans have had majorities again and again, and it's always gutless, weasel Republicans who back down said, oh no, we're going too big Bird, who, by the way, has not been part of public broadcasting since they got sold to HBO, who then turned around and sold them to Netflix. Yeah. I don't even understand why they're still using this argument of big Bird, except that you know it was effective maybe against Milk Romney. Look, the elite are getting your money because they think they're entitled to your money. And let's face it, there's not a lot of elites have anymore. Their college degrees are embarrassing now everyone. You know, you tell people, yeah, I've got my master's in Erotic Persian literature, you know, So what does that mean to mean? You got one hundred thouand thousand debt and you're writing the names of people's people's names on the side of coffee cops, that's what that means. Yeah, we're gonna impress somebody. Now, don't tell them you send your kid to Harvard, particularly they're Jewish. When you send your kids to HVAC school. That's got that'll impress people. So they don't have that school choice is letting more and more of those people into their private schools. Those people's kids are coming. That's terrible. And so what do they have left? They know a lot. So they've got the ability to force people who live in trailer parks listening to country music to pay for their master piece theater. That's what they got left. Yeah, it's interesting. I'm going to actually take that topic of the HVAC stuff. I've got the clip from Mike Rowe who was talking about AI displacing white collar jobs. But you know, the blue collar jobs aren't going anywhere. They're actually going to be more of those needed. And to your point about sort of the difference in the quote unquote elites, I hate the term because they're not. But the these elites and the things that they used to be able to outwardly express their elitism with, they no longer can because of this flattening. Thank you capitalism, right, this flattening. So people now can dress very similarly, they can get similar cars, live in homes and such, and there's nothing now that defines the difference in an outward way and and so this was one of the ways you could walk around with your NPR you know, tote bag or bumper sticker. And look. I worked for the local NPR affiliate right out of college. I mailed people their coffee mugs and their tote bags, and like they they did not hire me in their newsroom. So I ended up over here. And thank god. I have nothing against PBS and NPR existing, it's just taking my money that I objected to. So I was in Boston at the Biometrics, the most successful FM talk station in the country, very doing very, very well, and then a long story having to do with political correctness and not me for a change, they decided to flip the station to hip hop music. Yeah, from talk to hip hop music. I have to confess my audition as rap master G Money did not go as well as one might have hoped. And well, here's what was interesting. We had two liberal hosts who did a show together. It was the lowest randed department. It's still good. They still did well and they were good, were good hosts. They both got hired by the local MPR station. I went in and said, hey, look about it up. I mean, come on. I've got twice the ratings they do. You have no left, you have no right of center content. I can be your I can prove with all your tax dollars and blah blah blah. And I was told we can't hire you because our listeners won't let us. And that was the point. They were just like conservative talk radio. People want to have their current beliefs reaffirmed. And these elite college education snob want you know, wine sipping liberals were just the same. They wanted liberal rush limball. That's what they. Wanted, right, but they use taxpayer money for it. And that's my objection. Sounds like that's yours too. Absolutely, And every time someone says the sentence out loud and not biased, I I've had to see a doctor three times now. I mean I hurt myself laughings. All right, all right, Michael Graham. You could read his whole piece, which I have, uh, And that's why I reached out to him to ask him to come on. You can read his piece. Uh. Inside Sources dot com? What is so Nhjournal dot com? Do they just publish your stuff there? Also? So in so Inside Sources provides content to newspapers around the country. Sometimes you're still popping up in the local papers. And we also own two local news sites, New Hampshire Journal and Delawarevelly Journal and these suburbs of Philly, and so that's that's what we do. But if you go to DC journal dot com every day, you'll find three four five new new articles, news and opinion, all on stuff that's part of the national debate. And we try to dig in the areas that don't get I don't think it enough attention, whether it's energy policy or crypto or whatever. And we bring it to a lot of different voices. Unlike NPR and PBS. You we have stuff from Crazy Center for American Publics, left wingers, we have stuff from Cato libertarians. The fact we do a popular point counterpoint feature where we put two completely opposite opinions next to each other and they get picked up by one hundreds of newspapers the country. Nice all right. And also i've seen you on Mark Halpern's new podcast. Oh yes, yeah, Alpin's yeah, he's having me on. But I hey, back in the day, I was even on NPR on occasion. Scott Simon is a great guy, sweetheart. I have nothing against some of the people there, some of the best reporters I know works for NPR. It's just what the heck. We do not need government, taxpayer taxpair funded media in the era of the Internet and Wi Fi is like walking into a bordello and saying, you know, this place needs more hookers. That's what we need. Where are the hookers? Michael Graham, Thanks for your time, buddy. Good to hear from you. Glad you're doing well. Thank you, sir, Thank you all right. If you're listening to this show, you know I try to keep up with all sorts of current events, and I know you do too, And you've probably heard me say get your news from multiple sources. Why well, because it's how you detect media bias, which is why I've been so impressed with ground News. It's an app and it's a website and it combines news from around the world in one place so you can compare coverage and verify information. You can check it out at check dot ground, dot news slash pete. I put the link in the podcast description too. I started using ground News a few months ago and more recently chose to work with them as an affiliate because it lets me see clearly how stories get covered and by whom. The blind spot feature shows you which stories get ignored by the left and the right. See for yourself. Check dot Ground, dot news slash pete. Subscribe through that link and you'll get fifteen percent off any subscription. I use the Vantage plan to get unlimited access to every feature. Your subscription then not only helps my podcast, but it also supports Ground News as they make the media landscape more transparent. Alrighty, so one of the arguments here, Look, I completely agree. I completely agree, and I am happy that the Republicans have finally defunded NPR and PBS. This has been something I have wanted to see for twenty five years. Again, I worked at an NPR affiliate, and I remember people were freaking out when the original cuts to PBS were proposed, like back in the eighties under Reagan, and everybody said, oh my gosh, what's gonna happen. It's going to go off the year. And actually what happened was increased donations and it made as one who worked in the membership department, it made it easier to make those pleas to the audience to say, hey, we're losing money and we need you to step up, because a lot of the listeners could just say, well, they're getting taxpayer funds anyway, they don't need my money really, and so it eliminated that excuse and they saw their donations go up. They also saw a focus on what they call underwriting, because you can't call it advertising in NPR world, so they would underwrite. And you hear the ads they run ads. They run ads on NPR and PBS, right, they just do it in a way that makes it sound like you know, somebody who's half in a coma is reading a bumper sticker to you, right, Like that's or like the mission statement for a corporation. And those are nonprofits by the way, So all of those things they get to write them off and everything, so their underwriting is solid. They bring in money in healthy radio markets. I would say, hey, if you've got a decent sales staff there, they make money off of their listener directly through donations. They also have found this brand new revenue stream along with like the Charlotte Observer, where they take grants to pay for positions. They get grant money from like Climate Justice whatever foundation, So they're they're pulling in a lot of money. And there is no ethical reason why I, as an employee who of a commercial radio station that that competes with them for advertising dollars, right, Because if my ratings aren't good enough and I can't get you know, advertisers to be a part of the WBT family, then I'm out of a job. And that is not a pressure that the NPR folks face. And this latest argument that was trotted out that oh, you have to fund NPR and PBS or else people in rural America will lose access to emergency alerts is probably the most asenine argument I have ever heard when it comes to defending taxpayer subsidization of public broadcasting. It's just ridiculous, absolutely ridiculous. I'm not I have never never heard anybody say they rely on NPR. They don't tout it, NPR doesn't promote it. They're not like, listen to us for your emergency situations. We do, we do? They don't. They never had to, right, But now all of a sudden that funding is on the table to be cut. Now all of a sudden, Oh wait a minute, what what would have happened like in Texas, for example, with the recent floods. They wouldn't have heard the NPR affiliate at the preteen girls camp. They Oh my god, gosh, they missed the sirens or they missed the alerts on the NPR affiliate. Yeah, it actually took Texas Public Radio nineteen hours to post anything about the flooding on its social media pages after the National Weather Service first posted its alert on July third. When the flood hit at four a m. On July fourth, instead of providing local news, the NPR affiliate in Kerrville aired morning edition out of Washington, DC. So stuff it with this argument. Okay, it's crap. You guys don't do this kind of service. Commercial radio AM radio specifically has my entire career and long before I ever got into radio. This is what commercial radio stations do. But if you want to start, we can give you some pointers. Here's a great idea. 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And I listened to it enough. You know, for years. When I used to work in Ashville, I was still living in Charlotte. I was domiciled here in Charlotte. Christy was still working here in Charlotte, and I would drive up and down on the weekends. Basically, I would go up there, I would spend the week up there and work, and then I would drive back for the weekends and I would listen to NPR programming. I listened to a lot of NPR shows and news and they are all told the same way. All of their shows, all of their news stories and newscasts, they're all filtered through the same critical prism as in critical race theory, as in gender queer theory. DEI it's all and climate change. Of course, everything is climate change. Sonny Wright, who is a writer, He says NPR is so incredibly vital to everybody's life that the taxpayers aren't forced to finance it, nobody else will want to. Exactly, you can't say this is such a vital thing for everybody that it has to be financed, Yet nobody wants to finance it, because the market would recognize, as it does with this station and commercial stations right that they realize there is great value. There's great return on your investment. By the way, call our sales department if you would like the data there. The ROI on radio is huge, and so why not just allow that to be the case. You're all, look, you're already biased. We already know you're biased. Of course, the CEO of NPR is like, oh, if you have some evidence of biased, you let me know. And you know, show me the story, show you the story. They're all the stories. They are all the stories. Every NPR story follows the same format. You've got, you know, some ash. One commenter on X said, you got a simple, good statement to start off with and then you get, you know, fifteen minutes of soul searching and whining about it. And the example offered was scientists, all right, hang on, I'll do it this way. Scientists have discovered that breathing is good for you, but what are the societal costs? Is the carbon footprint really worth it? Next up on Fresh Air, Yeah, Like, that's the model. It's always the same in their news stories. It's always the same. John Gabriel, he did a great outline on this. You know, you hear the anchor with a toss to the reporter. It's all recorded, of course, and highly produced. You get all the natural sound in there and stuff. So here's the LATINX equity reporter, Esperanza van Zandt, and it'll start off with Candide, a biracial amputee, opens the door and welcomes me with a smoldering smudge stick, as is the way of her Cholanganana Peruvian collective. Then you hear the alp pack up dedicated to a socialist future for the Andes and her home of Manhattan car horns. Like that's it. That's the model. It's always the same sort of storytelling. The story's changed but it's always the same format. And but I when I say they change, I mean the characters change, but the underlying narratives never do. And I listen again, I listen to enough of it to know I listen to it to hear what they are saying. I'm quite sure nobody over on the NPR side ever listens to me or listens to BT. I'm pretty sure about that, because things that we report on never seem to make it over there. If I hear stuff over there that I think is important or interesting, I bring it here. I read, I will read stuff from stories. Buy the local NPR affiliate if they do, and they've got reporters on staff over there. But here's the other dirty secret. There are a lot of NPR stations, like hundreds of them that they don't have any local staff, they don't have local newsrooms. And the finances on all of this it's just basically it's well, it's like the medicaid racket, where you extract money from one end through taxes and then you cycle it through and then force it back to your preferred destination. And that's the way the NPR model works. And that's buy law. By the way, I'm not attacking NPR and their affiliates for that. That's the way the law works. They have to pay NPR, so while the grants go to the local stations, if they want to be an NPR affiliate, they have to pay for that content. Did you know that they have to buy those shows. You don't buy shows and radio and commercial radio. Did you know that? I think Limbaugh was the only show you ever had to pay for, really, and because you know, he had a massive ratings and so he could justify it. People wanted the show. But like all of the other nationally syndicated programs, they offer those for free and they sell the advertising. NPR no, they charge all of their affiliates for the programming. 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They are your life told through the eyes of everyone around you and all who came before you, and they will tell others to come who you are. Visit creative video dot com. Here's a message on the text line from a seven oh four number. They didn't give me their name. I listen to NPR every day. There's a lot of all caps here, so should I try to Should I do an affectation for the all caps when they were like I listened to NPR every day. I alternate during your show exclamation point. I think I should read it like that, so you know when they're trying to reinforce a point. Okay, they do have opposing views. They Okay, they have roundtables with Republican and Democrats. Yeah, I've heard those Just because somebody claims to be a Republican doesn't mean they are espousing, you know, pro Trumpian views they're defending Trump. They don't. They don't bring on They have a very narrow view of and rolodex of the Republicans that they bring on guys like David Brooks, who loved Obama for the crease in his pants, right, like that's the that's the kind they'll bring on, the Bulwark guys. They'll bring on the Dispatch guys, right, they'll bring them on, maybe Brett Stevens from the New York Times. Anyway, they do movie reviews. I've never listened and heard them say the anti Christian, anti heterosexual, anti Republican. Have you listened to This American Life? I love that show. Take it from an avid NBR listener. They are not anti conservative. Okay, do not hear what I did not say. As Vince Cochley would say, it's a great line. Did I say that NPR was anti conservative? I did not. Now somebody else may have, but I did not. I've never said they're anti conservative, but they are liberal. They lean left. I listened to the programming as well. I used to listen to this American Life all the time when I would drive down the mountain, followed by uh, it's not space lab, it's a radio lab. Yeah yeah, and this American Life. I would listen and at the end of every episode they would rattle off like seventeen thousand producers, like Wow, they certainly have a huge payroll. Low. I mean what we could do with that kind of with those kinds of taxpayer funded resources. Look, NPR can be whatever it wants to be, can be whatever they want to be. I don't care. I do care if you're going to take my money and support that programming, that's all. Just compete. It's the same thing with public schools. Just you know, you can't keep siphoning money out of my wallet and people who don't listen to that product. You can't keep taking our money and using it to pay for, you know, entertainment for you because you like it. That's all. It's very clear, Like I haven't even talked about like all of the examples. Maybe I'll play them for you. Because Senator John Kennedy from Louisiana, he brought out all of the headlines and he started reading them on the floor of the Senate during this debate yesterday, headline after headline after headline after headline after headline. I mean it was just scores of them, which convey a viewpoint, a political viewpoint. Again, you are free to do that, this is America. You are not free, though, to use taxpayer funds to advance your opinions like that. That's all. Supporters like Representative Chris Pappis claim that without NPR and PBS you won't get the local news you need, leaving you tragically uninformed about life in your community. But as the Media Research Center has shown and listeners and viewers of NPR and PBS can attest, public radio and public television provide very little local news. A review of content found just five point four percent of daily programming is locally produced news, and a significant part of that is simply reading the national news off of the NPR wire. That's it. Now. That's not to say that they don't produce any news. Some stations do more, some stations do less. There are some, I mean up in Asheville, I think there are like four NPR stations up there. One plays smooth jazz, you know, and uh, you know, one plays your standard fare of you know, fresh air Morning Edition all things considered here in town. You know, they run the BBC and all that, and they do have local newscasts, but we have local newscasts. We got breaking Bret Jensen out there. Right. When I first started at WBT in nineteen ninety nine, we had five full time reporters here, so local newscasts. And look at us now, right, we have local programming from what five am until now nine pm? Right, that's all local. See, it can be done. So this idea that we need the money, although it's only such a tiny little part, but we need it or we can't do what we're doing. I don't buy it. I don't believe it. I don't believe it because I work in this industry and I've been in this industry for thirty years, and I worked for an NBR affiliate in their membership department, mainly mailing coffee mugs, yes, doing the daily deposit, and I would organize all of the food for the fun drives. And I have no ill will towards NPR. Like I said, I think some of their content is good. I've talked about their content they make good the local affiliate and some of the national programs they do produce good content, you just can't use my money to do it. That's all I'm saying. I will listen to other stations, just don't because they don't use my money. That's all. I think. It's a very simple standard, you know. But here's a question that Michael Graham asked in his piece at the New Hampshire Journal The Nhjournal dot com. We've talked to Michael at the beginning of the program. He said, so, what's the point? Why do they fight so hard? And he says, it's privilege, And he talked about this a little bit in the interview. It's privilege, right, And there is a reason why liberals and Democrats and media. But I repeat myself, there's a reason why they are fighting so hard to preserve these funds, and why Republicans have for decades opposed the funds. Why do you think that is? If NPR was giving a fair shot to Republicans, why do they want to defund it? Right? Because they're just speaking truth to power? Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah? And why do liberals try to boycott commercial stations like this one? Right? Why do they hate us? And why to silence conservative talk radio? They don't like what we are producing because they find it to be biased against what they believe, so like, the proof is there. I'm not trying to convince you that you to stop listening. I'm just saying you can't deny the bias. All right. That'll do it for this episode. Thank you so much for listening. I not do the show without your support and the support of the businesses that advertise on the podcast, so if you'd like, please support them too and tell them you heard it here. You can also become a patron at my Patreon page or go to dpetecleanershow dot com. Again, thank you so much for listening, and don't break anything while I'm gone.