A closer look at B of A Stadium renovations | Hour 1

What's going on? Thank you so much for listening to this podcast. It is heard live every day from noon to three on WBT radio in Charlotte. And if you want exclusive content like invitations to events, the weekly live stream, my daily show prep with all the links, become a patron, go to the peak calendar show.com. Make sure you hit the subscribe button, get every episode for free right to your smartphone or tablet. And again, thank you so much for your support. It is the Pete Callender Show, as I am sure you can hear. I am not Pete Callender. It's Nick Craig, host of the Carolina Journal NewsHour and the Nick Craig Show in for Pete as we roll into a Halloween weekend. We're here for the next three hours. You can be part of the program. 704-570-1079 is our phone number. That is where you can call or text. Be part of the program. 704-570-1079, our WPD text line number. is driven by Keffer Chrysler Dodge Jeep Ram. The family store will get into a lot of your thoughts and comments. We've got a busy program for you coming up this afternoon. We're going to start off with something that happened all the way back in June of 2024. As a state auditor, Dave Bullock will join us coming up in about 15 minutes. That is when the city of Charlotte, the Charlotte city council voted seven to three to approve a $ 650 million financing package to conduct improvements and renovations at bank of America stadium. Of course, home of the Carolina Panthers. And, These big time stadium projects have received a lot of criticism and a lot of scrutiny in recent years. And I think for good reason, and I don't know that you'll find a better example. of one of these programs that has gone awry than in upstate New York, the brand new Highmark Stadium, the home of the Buffalo Bills, where taxpayers shelled out billions of dollars on a program and a project that ran nearly twice what its estimated budget was. Get a little glow to this. When it was initially pitched and initially agreed upon, it was set to cost somewhere in. The ballpark of $ 1 to $ 1. 4 billion in 2022. It opened this year at the start of the 2026 NFL season and had a price tag of more than $ 2. 2 billion. And for everyday regular working class families throughout the entirety of the state of New York, they had to foot that bill. They had to pay for a NFL franchise that is worth billions of dollars to make improvements to their stadium. And of course, as I looked before doing some prep for the show, you can't get into Highmark Stadium this Sunday as the Bills play the Baltimore Ravens for less than $ 300 a ticket. So you are upfronting the cost of a major renovator in the case of Highmark, a brand new stadium to be built for a franchise that essentially has a money printer within the NFL and the Buffalo Bills. You pay for it and then you have to cash out your 401k to bring you and your family to one of their games on a Sunday just outside of Buffalo in Orchard Park, New York. And so it's no surprise that there's a lot of criticism of these projects. And as I mentioned back in 2024, this was not a unanimous vote by the city of Charlotte or the Charlotte city council. This was a seven to three vote to move forward with this project, which is going to cost taxpayers and those living in the city of Charlotte, somewhere in the ballpark of $ 650 million over the next couple of years. As this project, I think is expected to be completed sometime in the 2030 time range. Now, Here is some good news. Now, we can't go back and flip back the clocks and change this decision. But what we can do is keep an eye as to the project as it continues to play out. And that is exactly... what we learned this week from state auditor Dave Bolick's office within, of course, the state audit office up in Raleigh. Unlike what you typically see, which is these projects go forward, all of this money is spent, hundreds of millions, billions of dollars, when it's all said and done. And then we retroactively look at it and say, man, we wasted a bunch of money there. We weren't really prudent with our finances on this side. This was a disaster over here. At that point, it's already done, right? The stadium is built. The renovations are done. The money has been spent. And all you can do is write a report up about it and say, well, gosh, darn it. We hope that this doesn't happen again. And then of course, 15 or 20 years down the line, when the same thing inevitably will happen, it continues to happen again. And the auditor's office, is deciding that they're going to take a different approach to this, which I think is really good. Instead of doing a post-mortem when this project is slated to be complete sometime around 2030, they're going to be actively watching this project as it unfolds. They're going to be continually keeping an eye on the finances because, again, at the end of the day, this is taxpayer monies that we're talking about. This is not a private investment. This is a city, a municipal government in the city of Charlotte that is deciding that they are going to use the money that you work hard for each and every day to fund a renovation to Bank of America Stadium. And I'm not saying that the renovation doesn't need to be done. I'm not even giving you my opinions on the renovation itself, but we should, as citizens, not only of the city of Charlotte, but I would argue throughout the rest of North Carolina, we should be able to see when we approve a massive project like this, right? We're not talking about a couple hundred thousand dollars, or even tens of thousands of dollars. We're talking about a $ 650 million public contribution to a major renovation to North and South Carolina's. Only NFL team. And so should we be able to keep an eye on this project as it plays out? Should we be able to check in from time to time and see how is our money being spent? I think that's a fair thing to ask. I think that's a fair thing that we should be able to expect. And I'm very fortunate that we're going to watch. I think we're fortunate that we're going to see this play out. And hopefully that this is a model that we can see replicated not only across the rest of the state of North Carolina, but also through the rest of the United States. Because these stadium deals and stadium projects are insane. I mean, you watch some of these discussions that take place all across the U S I know that down in Florida right now, the Tampa Bay rays who were just in the world series and lost to the Milwaukee brewers. They're looking to make some changes in the next couple of years. They're talking about potentially moving the franchise. They're all over the place. And so they're, playing out right now as local governments down in southern Florida are unsure whether they want to cough up billions of dollars worth of taxpayer monies to rebuild these stadiums, it makes sense that we have a bird's eye view of how these things continue to play out. We absolutely, as taxpayers, not only in Charlotte, but across the rest of the state, should demand that this is what we see. I don't believe that there is anything in this series of ongoing reports that we are being told are going to come out of the auditor's office that is above the fold, that is a bridge too far as it relates to, again, a major public investment of some $ 650 million. Bill is texting in on our WBT text line driven by Keffer Chrysler Dodge Jeep Ram, the family store. He says, Nick, it's shameful that fans and taxpayers foot the bill for these stadiums and do not get to participate when the franchises are sold. Politicians need to ensure that the taxpayers have equity stake in in the valuation upside. That's a great point, Bill. And then of course you can't afford to get in there. And if you can, you're going to drop six or $ 700 on a, with tickets and food to enjoy yourself. When you show up on a Sunday or Thursday night to watch your favorite team play, it's just a very frustrating thing to watch. And it is unfortunately become kind of the norm across the United States with taxpayers having to foot the bill for these billion-dollar franchises and essentially no accountability at all when these things are said and done. We look back and go, wow, can you believe that that costs $ 2. 2 billion? Oh, and hey, it's $ 300 to get in the door. Enjoy that. The holidays will be here before you know it, and so now is the time to create precious and priceless family heirlooms that will last for generations. Take your old photos, slides, films, and tapes to create a video in Mint Hill. 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We were just talking before the break about this major $ 650 million plan approved by the Charlotte City Council back in 2020. to conduct improvements and renovations of Bank of America Stadium, the home of the Carolina Panthers. We've got a brand new report out from the North Carolina State Auditor's Office this week to walk us through some of those details and tell us what we can expect in the years to come. It's my pleasure to welcome State Auditor Dave Bolick to our airwaves this morning, or this afternoon, I should say. Auditor Bolick, you are going to be keeping a close eye as this project continues to unfold. That's something that's not the norm. We normally look retrospectively at these projects. Why is that important? Well, thanks for having me, Nick, and it's good to be with you. Look, this does mark a shift in work at the state auditor's office to provide ongoing transparency with the Bank of America renovations. Let's be clear, $ 650 million, that number is hard for me personally, and I think average North Carolinians to wrap their arms around, that's a tremendous amount of public dollars. And it is, by the way, to the best of our knowledge, and we've looked back in history, it's the largest single tranche of public money going to a private entity in the history of the state of North Carolina. So if the state auditor's office is not keeping tabs on that funding, then we shouldn't exist, in my opinion. So that's why we've jumped in with this new approach of giving some ongoing transparency. This was approved by a 7-3 vote backed by the Charlotte City Council in 2024. Your first report is out this week, and that's something that you're going to be following now through around 2030 when the project is set to complete. What did you find in this very early report, one of many that we'll see in the years to come? Yeah, so early on, we see an initial expenditure of $ 3. 1 million that's been so far dispersed. By the way, the report also gets really in the weeds, Nick. Average citizen probably doesn't realize the process of issuing a bond, how the city does that, how they receive those funds, how those funds are ultimately dispersed. This first report actually details that process. I think it's important for citizens to have some transparency on that. After all, to use a fairly accurate and simple analogy, a bond is nothing more than the people's credit card. And that first $ 3. 1 million that's been expended in public monies, $ 2. 5 million went to construction costs, building and structural at $ 1 million, mechanical, electrical, plumbing $ 711, 000, construction management $ 562, 000, landscaping and other infrastructure projects $ 326, 000, professional design at $ 64, 000. And then, you know, the cost of actually financing that debt, this stuff's expensive to actually issue $ 632, 000 spent on debt financing costs. Walk us through those debt financing costs for those that obviously, I can't imagine most folks, State Auditor Bullock, have gone through and borrowed somewhere in the ballpark of $ 650 million. What does that cost, and is that something normal that you would expect with a bond of this size? That's normal cost. You got about $ 300, 000 in legal services, the financial advisory services, quarter million dollars plus. That is directing how these bonds are purchased, getting it to the financial houses that actually collect money from investors who invest in municipal bonds. $ 42, 000 to report this and make sure that the city of Charlotte has, uh, gets credit and it's credit rating, uh, you know, the reporting to the credit rating services so that, uh, when needed the city of Charlotte can continue to borrow money. Trustee agent services so far have accounted for $ 24, 000 and, uh, just document costs at 13,000. Again, this stuff's expensive to do, but it's a public policy project approved by the city council. Uh, Again, I think this should be great. We've got a good working relationship with Tepper Sports at the state auditor's office. They've been forthcoming and transparent thus far with the project costs. The city of Charlotte has been cooperative and transparent. It really, I think, should be to the benefit of the public to know on an ongoing basis how this money is spent and what they're getting for their dollars. And it wasn't just the Charlotte city council that had a vote and determined to move forward with this. They did in fact, do that seven to three back in 2024, but in April of this year, the local government commission in which you sit on also voted in favor of this project. As I understand it, walk us through that. Yeah. So the local government commission established back just after the depression purpose of the local government commission is multifold, but in this context, Local government commission does ultimately say grace over the issuance of bonds. And the question that the LGC asks is not an ideological or purpose question. It is, can the entity, and in this case, the city of Charlotte, afford the bond? And based on the numbers, the actuarial calculations backed by meals and occupancy tax, the city of Charlotte says, can afford this bond. So the LGC approved the issuance of the bond. Now it's up to the city and ultimately the citizens in Charlotte to pay the principal and interest back over the next several decades. Auditor Bullock, you. Noted at the open that this is the largest, at least from what you were able to find, the largest public issuance that we've seen here in North Carolina. It's also As I gather, the first time that the auditor's office has really dug into one of these large projects in an ongoing basis instead of doing a postmortem after everything is said and done. Why did you think that was important to do? I think it was really important because, again, this is the largest single tranche of money going to a private entity in the history of the state. So your listeners may or may not know that Bank of America Stadium is actually owned by Tepper Sports. So Mr. Tepper's organization owns the stadium. The county, the city, nor an authority owns that stadium. This is public dollars going to a private entity. This is a new project and is a shift project. in the auditor's office's perspective to provide that ongoing transparency. Look, if the auditor's office is going to be an oversight office, then we need to exercise that authority and be oversight. And I just do have to say, I compliment Tepper Sports and the City of Charlotte thus far with their cooperation and transparency on this. We've got a regular cadence with both organizations in terms of of getting invoices and payments and project updates. And we'll be providing this on a regular basis to the citizens of Charlotte. This is not a one and done. This is going to be at minimum quarterly. And as large tranches of dollars are expended, we're going to do reports on it. It's important because we want to look back four or five years from now and say, well, wow, Really, really, they didn't spend the money like they said they were going to spend it. And this really provides a true look at exactly how public dollars are being spent. Yeah, and that latter scenario is something that a lot of residents in the state of New York are asking themselves right now after more than $ 2. 2 billion expensed on Highmark Stadium, the home of the Buffalo Bills. So we look forward. To seeing those reports regularly here in North Carolina. Auditor Bullock, as we run out of time here this afternoon, tell folks how they can stay up to date with your office. You're constantly cranking out reports and providing transparency to the people of North Carolina. Yeah, we are. We're cranking them out on a regular basis. I actually had a bond report on the town of Chapel Hill issued today on housing bonds. It's auditor.nc.gov. Go sign up. Once every two weeks, we send out a newsletter with links, and we also send the citizens every single report and audit that the office produces. Auditor Bullock, thanks for the time, as always. Appreciate you keeping an eye here on taxpayer dollars across the Charlotte metro. Thank you. Glad to do it. All right, real quick. Every government number gets revised, right? Every projection gets walked back. Gold does not file corrections like GovCo. Revelation Gold Group helps families hold physical gold and silver, including in a tax-advantaged gold IRA. It's real, it's in your name, and 10 minutes tells you if your retirement account qualifies. If you want to learn more, go to calendarmetals.com. That's calendarmetals.com. There is a link in the podcast description. Or if you want to talk to somebody, you can call 888-465-3049. Appreciate the time from State Auditor Dave Bola kind of walking us through what we can expect to see out of the auditor's office, I guess, every quarter, presumably now through sometime in 2030, when these massive renovations and improvements are set to be done at Bank of America Stadium. And there's an interesting comment coming in on our WBT text line driven by Kepper Chrysler Dodge Jeep Ram. It is a Dean. He says, this is a wasted discussion. It's like discussing the I-77 toll road. The payers have nothing to say about this outcome. Taxpayers are payers. Politicians are decision makers. And, and Dean, I don't totally disagree with you. I mean, the decision was in fact made by the Charlotte city council in 2024. So unless you and I are going to team up and build a time machine and change the political structure of the Charlotte city council back in June of 2024, you're right. The decision of issuing $ 650 million worth of bonds to do renovations and constructions at bank of America stadium is is not going to change. But the benefit and why I think that conversation was important and why these quarterly reports at minimum that we're going to get out of the auditor's office is that if things are starting to run out of control and if there are problems that start propping up, and there probably will be, you're talking about a more than billion dollar project in all likelihood, when this thing is said and done with that being the case, at least we can. Know about it in real time. And hopefully because these reports obviously will be public through the state auditor's office, that something can be done about it, right? The problem with all of these projects and let's just get rid of this specific renovation of bank of America city. And let's talk about government in general. The problem that we see all the time, and it's why so many conservatives like myself are so critical and hypercritical of government is because we always find out after the fact, right? The disaster has already taken place. the money has been spent. The goal was not achieved. And we find out a year, two, three, four years down the road that the whole thing was a mess. It was a complete waste of taxpayer dollars. And then of course, unless you're intend on building a time machine, there's nothing that you can do about it. Yes. You can vote the people out. That are responsible for it. Sure. But you're not actually going to fix the problem in real time because there's never any data in real time. And that's why I think these quarterly reports from the auditor's office, the first one coming out just this week. will allow the public who, again, to Dean's point, and he makes a very good one about in large part of some of the discussion is wasted. At least we can know what's going on in real time. And one thing that we have definitely seen in recent years at all levels of government, whether we're talking about a municipal government like the city of Charlotte or a county government like Mecklenburg County or the state of North Carolina as a whole, when you start shining a light on this stuff, miraculously, I know this is going to be crazy to say, but when you start shining a light on some of this stuff and there's public reporting and you've got an watchdog agency like the state auditor's office that's publishing reports, it seems like many of these major issues that we would find out about years down the line, they magically disappear. And why might that be the case? It's got everything to do with the word transparency. Government doesn't like transparency, or maybe I should more accurately say the vast majority of government doesn't like transparency. They want to be able to operate and handle their business the way that they want. And many a times they're very frustrated when you or I or other people start trying to dig their nose into what's going on. Start looking behind the curtain. Start digging into some of the details. Everybody kind of gets a little spooked. They don't tend to like that. And why is that the case? Because we know there's so much waste. We know there's so much nonsensical bureaucratic BS that exists in so many of these governments across the state of North Carolina and, of course, much larger across the nation and up in Washington, D.C. And so I just I don't know that we I don't think the vast majority of people truly appreciate these kinds of reports that we're seeing coming out. This is important stuff, but it's a dense report. It's 24 pages long. It's very in the weeds. I read through the entire thing earlier this week, and it's it's it was enough to kind of cross my eyes. There was so much. Going on in that report specifically as it relates to the process of issuing the bond, how the disbursement of that money works. It is a very complicated matter that is unfolding, but they're not going to be able to hide behind, oh, well, this is just government. No, we just heard straight from the state auditor that he's not going to allow that to happen, that he is going to make sure that they are continuing to look at this in the months and years to come. So looking at going back to our text line, Danny is texting and he says, I have a question about all the money they're spending to rebuild the Excelsior building. That is a waste. I mean, again, in terms of was this a good project or not? Was this a smart idea or not? That decision was one to be made by the Charlotte City Council. And you heard from the state auditor and Dave Bullock. the local government commission that gave its final approval of this project back in April is not an entity that determines whether this is a good use of taxpayer dollars or not. The role of the local government commission, which is chaired by, by the state treasurer, currently Brad Briner. There's a series of council of state members on that board, including the state auditor and Dave Bolick. Their obligation and the charter of the local government commission sets out a path to make sure that a municipality like the city of Charlotte can afford to actually finance that debt. And no surprise, with the large scale and scope of the city of Charlotte, they were able to do that. And there was math to back up the fact that that they could afford to take out $ 650 million worth of debt and finance this project. That was the goal of the local government commission. They were not determining whether it was a good idea or not for taxpayers in the city of Charlotte to pay for $ 650 plus million worth of renovations at Bank of America Stadium. That was not their goal. That was a decision at the local level. And of course, as you've, for those that listen to my program day in and day out, you've heard me say constantly, I sound like a broken record, All government is local. This is why municipal elections like we saw last year are so important and like we'll see coming up in 2027 because it's these major decisions. You heard from the state auditor. This is the largest in North Carolina history issuance of debt to a private entity that has ever existed in this state. And so if you decide and if you're somebody that sits home during municipal elections because you can't be bothered to get involved, this is the reason that you get involved. If you're not happy with a project like this, if you're not happy with the way that things are going in a municipality, well, you've got an opportunity every two years to show up and do something about it. We see that in our off-year elections. Voter turnout is abysmally low. Nobody bothers getting involved in the process whatsoever. And then this is the end result if you're unhappy with this project. I'm not necessarily casting a stone on this individual project. I think it's important that people know about it. I think it's important that individuals know what they're essentially on the hook for because, I mean, that's how this works. The city of Charlotte has no way to generate revenue. The only way they do it is through taxes. That's your money. That's my money. That's people that are visiting the queen city and traveling around, it's their money that is being spent, right? Because they don't make money. They don't do anything to justify making any sort of dollars. I want to round out this conversation on this major public expansion over at Bank of America Stadium. This project, unfortunately, garnered the attention of the Centers for Economic Accountability. Back in 2024, as I already noted, this original vote by the Charlotte City Council to approve $ 650 million for improvements and renovations at the stadium was done in June of 2024. We flash forward a couple of months to December the 30th. That is when the Center of Economic Accountability, and again, key word there, accountability, gave it its worst economic development deal of the year award. Now, obviously, I think most of the time you say, oh, we're getting an award for something. You would think that's a good thing. I would argue getting awarded the worst economic development deal of the year, getting that award is not necessarily something you're probably going to pin on the front of your shirt. And the argument for this had everything to do with a level of transparency. So the president of the Economic Accountability Organization said, said this back in 2024 when the Bank of America renovation got this award. He says, quote, this is an incredibly expensive stadium renovation project with a very flimsy economic justification. Agreed to behind closed doors with a partner who deserves plenty of due diligence. Despite those issues, Charlotte politicians rammed it through with as little public warning or input as possible, ignoring clear public opposition to both the substance and the process of the deal. To top it all off, they're not even getting a good football team out of it. This was again back in 2024 during what many would call some of the darker times. for the Carolina Panthers. And that was part of the issue when this was being discussed. You heard many of those similar conversations on this same radio station back when the city council was discussing this and making its final decision, its final seven to three vote to move forward with this project. It was rammed through. There was not anywhere near as much public input as needed for a 650, million dollar public obligation by the taxpayers within the city of Charlotte to fund this stadium. As you just heard from Dave Bollick not more than 25 minutes ago, this is the largest single issuance of a bond to a private entity. Well, it's going to the city, but for and being given to a private entity. In North Carolina history. You would assume something like that would go through the utmost level of transparency and public meetings and all of that fun jazz before it was approved. But no surprise with the city of Charlotte and their city council. It did not. Let's jump on over to our WBT hotline. We'll say good afternoon to Charlie. He's hanging on line one. Charlie, you're on the Pete Callender Show with Nick Craig. Go ahead. Hi. We really appreciate all the good stuff that you do. I think what we have here on this Bank of America bond is another greedy money grab. I think Jeremy Richardson did the same thing about maybe seven, eight, nine, ten years ago. And I think a lot of those funds did not actually go to the upfit of the stadium, which it was appropriated for. So here we go again. Well, I can say this, Charlie. We've seen a lot of these disastrous deals across the country. Fortunately, with these quarterly reports from the North Carolina State Auditor's Office, I think it's going to be very hard for this project to play out and not have that money being very clearly going to its stated purpose. If not, I can almost guarantee, I'm not going to speak for him, of course, but I can almost guarantee the state auditor will have no problem putting this project on blast if it turns out that the money's not being spent in a prudent fashion. Good, good. Okay, well, we thank you for your good due diligence and keeping us informed. Thank you. Thanks, Charlie. Appreciate your call. Enjoy your weekend. We'll see these reports again coming out on essentially a quarterly basis here from the auditor's office, and it's going to be a very interesting one to watch. It's going to be absolutely... fascinating to see this large sum of money, 650 million bucks that the city of Charlotte has incurred in terms of debt for this project. And, you know, just a quick aside, as we round out this conversation, can you blame these major sport team owners and franchisees for going this route? Because they're always approved or almost always approved, right? I mean, why would Dave Tepper take $ 650 million out of his own pocket if the city of Charlotte will pay for it? I mean, same thing with what's going on up in Buffalo or what went on up in Buffalo with the bills. Why would the bills and their organization shell out $ 2. 2 billion themselves when the taxpayers of the state of New York will fund half of it? I mean, we know that these projects get approved constantly, so it's really just not a crazy thing at all, is it? All right, that'll do it for this episode. Thank you so much for listening. I could not do the show without your support and the support of the businesses that advertise on the podcast. So if you'd like, please support them, too, and tell them you heard it here. You can also become a patron at my Patreon page or go to ThePeteCalenderShow.com. Again, thank you so much for listening, and don't break anything while I'm gone.